4 ms·

At the very least this has been a hotly contested conversation for a while in the US. I do still believe it's a founding principle of the US' legal system.

by xracy 2y ago

mcv 2y ago
It is, but as with many founding principles of the US, they don't always live up to them. I mean, Thomas Jefferson said it was self-evident that every man was created equal and had the right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness, yet he kept people as property in slavery. That just about sums up American theory vs practice. Same with the legal system: plenty of innocent people have been executed despite it being pretty clear they were innocent, simply because the legal system didn't allow the case to be reopened to handle the new evidence.
- milesrout 2y ago
  To be fair to Jefferson, he supported the eventual emancipation of slaves and the end of slavery, was strongly opposed to the international slave trade (he banned it) and freed some slaves. His stated reason for not doing more sooner was that he thought it would bring about immense unrest. And of course it did, in the end. The bloodiest war in American history.
  - mcv 2y ago
    Did he free his slaves? I thought he didn't. Washington did free some of his slaves when he died. Still not all, though. Imagine if these two political powerhouses had freed all the slaves, as their words suggested they should. US history would have looked very differently. No, I don't think supporting "eventual" emancipation is good enough if you don't do anything to actually bring it about.
    - milesrout 2y ago
      The most brutal part of slavery was the international slave trade which he banned. I don't think he did nothing. You have to understand a man's actions in the context of his time.
      - krapp 2y ago
        Jefferson was called a hypocrite and a coward in his time, though.
  - bigyabai 2y ago
    > His stated reason for not doing more sooner was that he thought it would bring about immense unrest. What a ridiculous reason in hindsight, huh? "Yes, the inevitable reconciliation of our gross injustices against fellow man will be fixed one day. But not now, because I like the comfort of the status quo and would prefer white people not die for a principled cause." To say nothing of his own slaves, this fickleness of leadership is not what American politics should aspire to.
milesrout 2y ago
Lots of things are founding principles of the American legal system, including freedom of speech, trial by jury, presumption of innocence, and the death penalty.

At the very least this has been a hotly contested conversation for a while in the US. I do still believe it's a founding principle of the US' legal system.

by xracy 2y ago

At the very least this has been a hotly contested conversation for a while in the US. I do still believe it's a founding principle of the US' legal system.

mcv 2y ago

It is, but as with many founding principles of the US, they don't always live up to them. I mean, Thomas Jefferson said it was self-evident that every man was created equal and had the right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness, yet he kept people as property in slavery. That just about sums up American theory vs practice. Same with the legal system: plenty of innocent people have been executed despite it being pretty clear they were innocent, simply because the legal system didn't allow the case to be reopened to handle the new evidence.

milesrout 2y ago
To be fair to Jefferson, he supported the eventual emancipation of slaves and the end of slavery, was strongly opposed to the international slave trade (he banned it) and freed some slaves. His stated reason for not doing more sooner was that he thought it would bring about immense unrest. And of course it did, in the end. The bloodiest war in American history.
- mcv 2y ago
  Did he free his slaves? I thought he didn't. Washington did free some of his slaves when he died. Still not all, though. Imagine if these two political powerhouses had freed all the slaves, as their words suggested they should. US history would have looked very differently. No, I don't think supporting "eventual" emancipation is good enough if you don't do anything to actually bring it about.
  - milesrout 2y ago
    The most brutal part of slavery was the international slave trade which he banned. I don't think he did nothing. You have to understand a man's actions in the context of his time.
    - krapp 2y ago
      Jefferson was called a hypocrite and a coward in his time, though.
- bigyabai 2y ago
  > His stated reason for not doing more sooner was that he thought it would bring about immense unrest. What a ridiculous reason in hindsight, huh? "Yes, the inevitable reconciliation of our gross injustices against fellow man will be fixed one day. But not now, because I like the comfort of the status quo and would prefer white people not die for a principled cause." To say nothing of his own slaves, this fickleness of leadership is not what American politics should aspire to.

milesrout 2y ago

Lots of things are founding principles of the American legal system, including freedom of speech, trial by jury, presumption of innocence, and the death penalty.