5 ms·

I think it's a mistake to think people are just oblivious. It's not a majority but there are actually a lot of people aware of these things and celebrating them

I think it's a mistake to think people are just oblivious. It's not a majority but there are actually a lot of people aware of these things and celebrating them. One thing I don't see mentioned a lot but Trump has made being a victim a fairly central part of his politics (him thinking all elections are rigged against him is a simple example of this) so this all makes sense as a sort of retribution. You can see the retribution, often personal, against people conspiring against him in a lot of his speeches and policies (he's even blamed immigrants before for bringing drugs and "poisoning the blood of our country" and implied they are conspiring against the US) and there are people that care about that retribution more than rights or other ideals. I could write pages more about how you can hear how the idea of victimization and retribution is part of his talks on tariffs, foreign policy, immigration, "DEI", law offices, the judicial system, etc but obviously it would be too long for an internet comment. Once I noticed it I started seeing it everywhere with him.

zmgsabst 2y ago
Trump isn’t the source of that, but a manifestation of it. People are tired of, eg, systemic discrimination being forced on them by elites (euphemized “DIE”) or courts which have outspoken activists refusing to enforce the law against career criminals. They want it to stop — and since elites refused to onboard that correction, they rallied behind a strongman to punish them.
- tdb7893 2y ago
  He's very very much not the source of this. It's been ascendant literally my whole life, my first foray into really thinking about politics was trying to convince my friends that humans caused climate change and there wasn't a conspiracy of climate scientists trying to trick them so they can get more grant money. You can see him pretty clearly expanding on and exploiting those existing currents though. One of the ways he got big in American politics is his support of the "birther" movement where he was convinced Obama wasn't born in the US (which, to be clear, was a ridiculous claim and especially galling to me since my birth certificate is from the same hospital and looks almost exactly like his). His political persona gas always been tied to the idea this idea that people are lying and working against America even if he didn't originate the idea. Edit: also tone is hard to parse on the internet so I'll clarify that this isn't really meant as an argument, it doesn't seem like we really disagree on what Trump's politics is about (even if we have different opinions on those politics). I mainly just wanted to clarify that I saw this long before Trump, even if he's now emblematic of it.
- aredox 2y ago
  >systemic discrimination being forced on them by elites ... Pot, meet kettle.
- PartiallyTyped 2y ago
  Trump and his ilk are literally “elites”, richest cabinet in history and that’s excluding the unelected SS cutter that meddles into everything. DEI, just so you know, also covers programmes that help poor communities by providing funding for education.
  - leovingi 2y ago
    My entire life, professional and otherwise, DEI has ultimately stood for nothing other than "less white people". Of course it's dressed up in definitions that sound beautiful and moral to the supporters of DEI, but at the end of the day whenever someone uses the term "diverse" they are talking about "less white people". When the company John Lewis was criticized for a lack of diversity [1], it was because they had too many whites. When the Academy Awards were criticized for a lack of diversity [2], it was because they had too many whites. When the EU institutions were criticized for a lack of diversity [3], it was because they had too many whites. When the BAFTAs were criticized for a lack of diversity [4], it was because they had too many whites. When investigative journalism in the US was criticized for a lack of diversity [5], it was because they had too many whites. When the show "Friends" was criticized for a lack of diversity [6], it was because they had too many whites. After decades and decades of this blatant animosity against people like me I can honestly say I do not care at all what Trump does to these programs or how he goes about destroying them, as long as they are destroyed and the people that supported them punished. [1] https://www.theguardian.com/business/2020/jun/16/john-lewis-criticised-for-lack-of-diversity-in-uk-top-ranks https://www.theguardian.com/business/2020/jun/16/john-lewis-... [2] https://www.wishtv.com/news/awards-shows-have-been-criticized-for-their-lack-of-diversity-for-years-why-are-they-so-slow-to-change/ https://www.wishtv.com/news/awards-shows-have-been-criticize... [3] https://www.theparliamentmagazine.eu/news/article/oped-lack-of-racial-diversity-continues-to-blight-eu-affairs https://www.theparliamentmagazine.eu/news/article/oped-lack-... [4] https://www.willistonian.org/baftas-criticized-for-lack-of-diversity/ https://www.willistonian.org/baftas-criticized-for-lack-of-d... [5] https://www.poynter.org/business-work/2020/investigative-journalism-long-criticized-for-a-lack-of-diversity-has-made-significant-developments-since-march/ https://www.poynter.org/business-work/2020/investigative-jou... [6] https://metro.co.uk/2023/04/02/lack-of-diversity-on-friends-mocked-on-snl-after-years-of-criticism-18542168/ https://metro.co.uk/2023/04/02/lack-of-diversity-on-friends-...
ryandrake 2y ago
> One thing I don't see mentioned a lot but Trump has made being a victim a fairly central part of his politics (him thinking all elections are rigged against him is a simple example of this) so this all makes sense as a sort of retribution. Imagined victimhood and a persecution complex are core, foundational pillars of MAGA. The whole movement is about how they are all the victims of the elite, persecuted by the media, harassed for their beliefs, and that the whole world is against them. Then, the minute they got power, their first priority was griefing others and cruelty to all of their favorite out-groups. There really is nothing more to it than pretend victimhood, leading to retribution.

zmgsabst 2y ago

Trump isn’t the source of that, but a manifestation of it. People are tired of, eg, systemic discrimination being forced on them by elites (euphemized “DIE”) or courts which have outspoken activists refusing to enforce the law against career criminals. They want it to stop — and since elites refused to onboard that correction, they rallied behind a strongman to punish them.

tdb7893 2y ago
He's very very much not the source of this. It's been ascendant literally my whole life, my first foray into really thinking about politics was trying to convince my friends that humans caused climate change and there wasn't a conspiracy of climate scientists trying to trick them so they can get more grant money. You can see him pretty clearly expanding on and exploiting those existing currents though. One of the ways he got big in American politics is his support of the "birther" movement where he was convinced Obama wasn't born in the US (which, to be clear, was a ridiculous claim and especially galling to me since my birth certificate is from the same hospital and looks almost exactly like his). His political persona gas always been tied to the idea this idea that people are lying and working against America even if he didn't originate the idea. Edit: also tone is hard to parse on the internet so I'll clarify that this isn't really meant as an argument, it doesn't seem like we really disagree on what Trump's politics is about (even if we have different opinions on those politics). I mainly just wanted to clarify that I saw this long before Trump, even if he's now emblematic of it.
aredox 2y ago
>systemic discrimination being forced on them by elites ... Pot, meet kettle.
PartiallyTyped 2y ago
Trump and his ilk are literally “elites”, richest cabinet in history and that’s excluding the unelected SS cutter that meddles into everything. DEI, just so you know, also covers programmes that help poor communities by providing funding for education.
- leovingi 2y ago
  My entire life, professional and otherwise, DEI has ultimately stood for nothing other than "less white people". Of course it's dressed up in definitions that sound beautiful and moral to the supporters of DEI, but at the end of the day whenever someone uses the term "diverse" they are talking about "less white people". When the company John Lewis was criticized for a lack of diversity [1], it was because they had too many whites. When the Academy Awards were criticized for a lack of diversity [2], it was because they had too many whites. When the EU institutions were criticized for a lack of diversity [3], it was because they had too many whites. When the BAFTAs were criticized for a lack of diversity [4], it was because they had too many whites. When investigative journalism in the US was criticized for a lack of diversity [5], it was because they had too many whites. When the show "Friends" was criticized for a lack of diversity [6], it was because they had too many whites. After decades and decades of this blatant animosity against people like me I can honestly say I do not care at all what Trump does to these programs or how he goes about destroying them, as long as they are destroyed and the people that supported them punished. [1] https://www.theguardian.com/business/2020/jun/16/john-lewis-criticised-for-lack-of-diversity-in-uk-top-ranks https://www.theguardian.com/business/2020/jun/16/john-lewis-... [2] https://www.wishtv.com/news/awards-shows-have-been-criticized-for-their-lack-of-diversity-for-years-why-are-they-so-slow-to-change/ https://www.wishtv.com/news/awards-shows-have-been-criticize... [3] https://www.theparliamentmagazine.eu/news/article/oped-lack-of-racial-diversity-continues-to-blight-eu-affairs https://www.theparliamentmagazine.eu/news/article/oped-lack-... [4] https://www.willistonian.org/baftas-criticized-for-lack-of-diversity/ https://www.willistonian.org/baftas-criticized-for-lack-of-d... [5] https://www.poynter.org/business-work/2020/investigative-journalism-long-criticized-for-a-lack-of-diversity-has-made-significant-developments-since-march/ https://www.poynter.org/business-work/2020/investigative-jou... [6] https://metro.co.uk/2023/04/02/lack-of-diversity-on-friends-mocked-on-snl-after-years-of-criticism-18542168/ https://metro.co.uk/2023/04/02/lack-of-diversity-on-friends-...

ryandrake 2y ago

> One thing I don't see mentioned a lot but Trump has made being a victim a fairly central part of his politics (him thinking all elections are rigged against him is a simple example of this) so this all makes sense as a sort of retribution. Imagined victimhood and a persecution complex are core, foundational pillars of MAGA. The whole movement is about how they are all the victims of the elite, persecuted by the media, harassed for their beliefs, and that the whole world is against them. Then, the minute they got power, their first priority was griefing others and cruelty to all of their favorite out-groups. There really is nothing more to it than pretend victimhood, leading to retribution.