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"the real reason has always been that mobile network operators don't like the interference high-altitude phones can cause: They're in view of potentially many b

"the real reason has always been that mobile network operators don't like the interference high-altitude phones can cause: They're in view of potentially many base stations". This makes zero sense: the aircraft is on the ground and not moving when the ban is put in place. The ban is removed at altitude, when, you say, that the phones are potentially 'in view' of many 'cell towers' (not base stations). In fact, the plane is essentially a Faraday cage at altitude, and a phone has almost zero chance of connecting to a tower, even shoved into a window pocket.

lxgr 2y ago
> The ban is removed at altitude Not in the US, where it applies throughout the flight. And at least in Europe, the ban is due to the risk of distraction/disorientation in case of an emergency, in my experience. > the plane is essentially a Faraday cage at altitude, and a phone has almost zero chance of connecting to a tower Counterpoint: I have a whole collection of “welcome to <place>, your roaming charges will be <exorbitant>” text messages on my phone from countries I’ve only ever overflown at 30k feet. This is from flights that do permit in-flight phone usage, but I believe my network has no roaming agreement with the microcell operator, so it keeps scanning and sometimes catches a bidirectional link to some long-range tower. (They’re specifically optimized for that in the North Sea and Atlantic for fishing boats, as far as I know, so for regular modern towers it’s probably less likely, but that separation hasn’t always existed.)
- kiwijamo 2y ago
  Supporting your counterpoint: I am a cell tower geek and I have an app on my phone that records the cell ID of every tower my phone attaches to. I once flew from Wellington to Auckland on an Airbus 320 and forgot to turn off Airplane mode. Arrived into Auckland and my app had logs around a hundred or so cells my phone managed to attach to. So it can happen. I've also had successful two-way text conversations while still in the air but low enough (e.g. when descending on approach to an airport). Saying a plane is a Faraday cage is a bit extreme but I do acknowledge the steel tubing around you will reduce the signal strength by quite a bit -- but not quite enough to 100% block out the signal it seems.
  - antonvs 2y ago
    Plane windows are large compared to radio waves. They'd need to be no more than about 5 cm wide to create a full Faraday cage.
- N19PEDL2 2y ago
  Supporting your counterpoint too: MH370 co-pilot's mobile phone did connect to a cell tower mid-flight after the hijacking. [0] [0] https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6839167/MH370-pilot-tried-use-phone-midflight-according-expert-review-report.html https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6839167/MH370-pilot...

lxgr 2y ago

> The ban is removed at altitude Not in the US, where it applies throughout the flight. And at least in Europe, the ban is due to the risk of distraction/disorientation in case of an emergency, in my experience. > the plane is essentially a Faraday cage at altitude, and a phone has almost zero chance of connecting to a tower Counterpoint: I have a whole collection of “welcome to <place>, your roaming charges will be <exorbitant>” text messages on my phone from countries I’ve only ever overflown at 30k feet. This is from flights that do permit in-flight phone usage, but I believe my network has no roaming agreement with the microcell operator, so it keeps scanning and sometimes catches a bidirectional link to some long-range tower. (They’re specifically optimized for that in the North Sea and Atlantic for fishing boats, as far as I know, so for regular modern towers it’s probably less likely, but that separation hasn’t always existed.)

kiwijamo 2y ago
Supporting your counterpoint: I am a cell tower geek and I have an app on my phone that records the cell ID of every tower my phone attaches to. I once flew from Wellington to Auckland on an Airbus 320 and forgot to turn off Airplane mode. Arrived into Auckland and my app had logs around a hundred or so cells my phone managed to attach to. So it can happen. I've also had successful two-way text conversations while still in the air but low enough (e.g. when descending on approach to an airport). Saying a plane is a Faraday cage is a bit extreme but I do acknowledge the steel tubing around you will reduce the signal strength by quite a bit -- but not quite enough to 100% block out the signal it seems.
- antonvs 2y ago
  Plane windows are large compared to radio waves. They'd need to be no more than about 5 cm wide to create a full Faraday cage.
N19PEDL2 2y ago
Supporting your counterpoint too: MH370 co-pilot's mobile phone did connect to a cell tower mid-flight after the hijacking. [0] [0] https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6839167/MH370-pilot-tried-use-phone-midflight-according-expert-review-report.html https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6839167/MH370-pilot...