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It is fascinating that a large percentage of modern Americans believe (taught in school or through Disney movies) that prior to the arrival of Europeans; native

It is fascinating that a large percentage of modern Americans believe (taught in school or through Disney movies) that prior to the arrival of Europeans; native American tribes were peaceful to each other. They often think that the land was inhabited by loving tribes that just wanted to be left alone to live in harmony with nature. The truth is that barbarism was common as tribes routinely slaughtered each other in numerous wars. Slavery, rape and human sacrifice were here far before the White man arrived. I am not saying that the conquerers from Europe didn't do some horrible things too; just that the narrative often taught in schools is inaccurate.

johntitorjr 2y ago
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Loughla 2y ago
I think it's less that they're taught that the native Americans were peaceful and more that they aren't really taught anything about the history of the native population. It usually starts when European settlers come here. As an aside; I went to the Smithsonian museum of native Americans or whatever it's called. I was MASSIVELY disappointed that it focused almost solely on post-European settlement. I was really hoping for history and information about the tribes before that. They're fascinating, and it seems a little backhanded to just focus on our impact on them (important obviously, but very dismissive of their long history).
- criddell 2y ago
  > I was really hoping for history and information about the tribes before that How much of that is known?
  - Loughla 2y ago
    I have no idea. And that's kind of the point. I'm assuming somebody can fill in some of the blanks for me.
  - ahazred8ta 2y ago
    We can tell a lot about their food sources, trade partners, economics, size of communities and civic centers, (material culture) but not much about politics, religion, folklore and class conflict. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archaeological_culture https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archaeological_culture
- hollerith 2y ago
  >focused almost solely on post-European settlement That is because the pre-European natives in North America did not write anything down. The only information we have not from European writers is material remains like arrowheads, pottery and the bones of the animals they butchered.
bambax 2y ago
I think it varies by geographical zones. While the Incas were a violent empire, it seems the Caribbeans were indeed populated with peaceful communities?
- lurquer 2y ago
  Oh yeah… The Aztecs were sweethearts. ‘Caribbean’, by the way, is derived from the ‘Canib’ Indians, from which we get another sweet and gentle word: Cannibal. Idealizing these cultures would be similar to some revisionist historian in 2525 waxing poetic about the Nazis in the mid-20th century.
keybored 2y ago
The peaceful native Americans view is about the pre-Columbian natives of present-day US. Not about the Aztecs (are you kidding?) or the Incas.
- adamtaylor_13 2y ago
  Right, but the point still stands. Go read “Empire of the Summer Moon” and tell me that the pre-Columbian natives were peaceful.
  - keybored 2y ago
    The point still stands? Why do people make these repetitive points. Yeah, I read the parent of my own comment. There is no reason for you to boorishly restate it.
    - keybored 2y ago
      > There is no reason for you to boorishly restate it. This was needlessly harsh. Sorry. :(
- didgetmaster 2y ago
  Since native Americans were not known for their writing of historical records; much of their history must be surmised from archeological digs. Enough is known that we can conclude that many tribes conducted warfare against their neighbors.
  - keybored 2y ago
    I don’t know why you are restating your point to me.
    - didgetmaster 2y ago
      I guess I took your last comment to mean that you believe that the tribes in North America were much more peaceful than those in Central and South America. While that could be true, I don't know that it is.
ch71r22 2y ago
There are a lot of myths about the way humans used to be, especially Native Americans. Were they utopian nature-lovers? Were they barbaric human-sacrificers? A good book on this topic is The Dawn of Everything, written by an anthropologist and an archaeologist. A YouTube video from one of the authors is here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8SJi0sHrEI4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8SJi0sHrEI4 I disagree with the idea that "barbarism was common" in Native American societies. I don't think you can generalize from the Incas so directly like this
MichaelRo 2y ago
Apocalypto by Mel Gibson did a great job of imprinting a visual image of pre-Columbian Aztecs. The tribe of villagers in the movie was depicted as peaceful, but I think it's only through limited observation time and in contrast with the brutal Aztecs. Otherwise I bet even those villagers were more like we observe the Papua New Guinea tribes of today, routinely mounting some expedition of murdering and pillaging the neighbouring village. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i_rejhUV0A0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i_rejhUV0A0

johntitorjr 2y ago

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Loughla 2y ago

I think it's less that they're taught that the native Americans were peaceful and more that they aren't really taught anything about the history of the native population. It usually starts when European settlers come here. As an aside; I went to the Smithsonian museum of native Americans or whatever it's called. I was MASSIVELY disappointed that it focused almost solely on post-European settlement. I was really hoping for history and information about the tribes before that. They're fascinating, and it seems a little backhanded to just focus on our impact on them (important obviously, but very dismissive of their long history).

criddell 2y ago
> I was really hoping for history and information about the tribes before that How much of that is known?
- Loughla 2y ago
  I have no idea. And that's kind of the point. I'm assuming somebody can fill in some of the blanks for me.
- ahazred8ta 2y ago
  We can tell a lot about their food sources, trade partners, economics, size of communities and civic centers, (material culture) but not much about politics, religion, folklore and class conflict. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archaeological_culture https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Archaeological_culture
hollerith 2y ago
>focused almost solely on post-European settlement That is because the pre-European natives in North America did not write anything down. The only information we have not from European writers is material remains like arrowheads, pottery and the bones of the animals they butchered.

bambax 2y ago

I think it varies by geographical zones. While the Incas were a violent empire, it seems the Caribbeans were indeed populated with peaceful communities?

lurquer 2y ago
Oh yeah… The Aztecs were sweethearts. ‘Caribbean’, by the way, is derived from the ‘Canib’ Indians, from which we get another sweet and gentle word: Cannibal. Idealizing these cultures would be similar to some revisionist historian in 2525 waxing poetic about the Nazis in the mid-20th century.

keybored 2y ago

The peaceful native Americans view is about the pre-Columbian natives of present-day US. Not about the Aztecs (are you kidding?) or the Incas.

adamtaylor_13 2y ago
Right, but the point still stands. Go read “Empire of the Summer Moon” and tell me that the pre-Columbian natives were peaceful.
- keybored 2y ago
  The point still stands? Why do people make these repetitive points. Yeah, I read the parent of my own comment. There is no reason for you to boorishly restate it.
  - keybored 2y ago
    > There is no reason for you to boorishly restate it. This was needlessly harsh. Sorry. :(
didgetmaster 2y ago
Since native Americans were not known for their writing of historical records; much of their history must be surmised from archeological digs. Enough is known that we can conclude that many tribes conducted warfare against their neighbors.
- keybored 2y ago
  I don’t know why you are restating your point to me.
  - didgetmaster 2y ago
    I guess I took your last comment to mean that you believe that the tribes in North America were much more peaceful than those in Central and South America. While that could be true, I don't know that it is.

ch71r22 2y ago

There are a lot of myths about the way humans used to be, especially Native Americans. Were they utopian nature-lovers? Were they barbaric human-sacrificers? A good book on this topic is The Dawn of Everything, written by an anthropologist and an archaeologist. A YouTube video from one of the authors is here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8SJi0sHrEI4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8SJi0sHrEI4 I disagree with the idea that "barbarism was common" in Native American societies. I don't think you can generalize from the Incas so directly like this

MichaelRo 2y ago

Apocalypto by Mel Gibson did a great job of imprinting a visual image of pre-Columbian Aztecs. The tribe of villagers in the movie was depicted as peaceful, but I think it's only through limited observation time and in contrast with the brutal Aztecs. Otherwise I bet even those villagers were more like we observe the Papua New Guinea tribes of today, routinely mounting some expedition of murdering and pillaging the neighbouring village. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i_rejhUV0A0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i_rejhUV0A0