5 ms·

Can you recommend Western companies that would be able to produce similar hardware at the same price point?

walterbell 2y ago
In the absence of PC Engines (RIP) Swiss design made in Taiwan, there is the South Korean ODROID from https://hardkernel.com https://hardkernel.com. Compulab in Israel has some customizable IoT boards, https://www.compulab.com/products/sbcs/sbc-iot-imx8-nxp-i-mx8m-mini-internet-of-things-single-board-computer/ https://www.compulab.com/products/sbcs/sbc-iot-imx8-nxp-i-mx... QNAP in Taiwan has QHora routers, but much higher price points.
- cycomanic 2y ago
  The irony here is that it's the US who has been proven to break into allied networks and infrastructure and done both political and industrial espionage against their allies.
  - walterbell 2y ago
    If global manufacturers would get with the program and ship blob-free hardware with mainline Linux support, owners could pick their desired firmware and software poison. Until then, we have Cambrian hardware innovation, old kernels and mystery firmware from Shenzen, which can be compromised by a broad spectrum of hostile actors.
  - greggsy 2y ago
    I hope it isn't a surprise that every country with sufficient resources and motives will do it to everyone else.
squarefoot 2y ago
Mikrotik sells also bare boards. They come with their RouterOS platform (Linux based, closed) but some can run OpenWRT. Also Olimex has really interesting and open products, but they're not primarily aimed at networking. https://mikrotik.com/products/group/routerboard https://mikrotik.com/products/group/routerboard https://www.olimex.com/ https://www.olimex.com/
sgjohnson 2y ago
https://store.ui.com/us/en/category/all-cloud-gateways/products/udr7 https://store.ui.com/us/en/category/all-cloud-gateways/produ... 4x 2.5GbE (one of them even a PoE port) 1x 10GbE SFP+ WiFi 7 with MLO $279
- microtonal 2y ago
  Ubiquiti gear is great, but does not use open source software like OpenWrt Two. And I think most modern Ubiquiti routers are not supported by OpenWrt.
  - sgjohnson 2y ago
    I don’t see how ubiquiti not being open source is relevant here, as the original question was > Can you recommend Western companies that would be able to produce similar hardware at the same price point? Besides, I’m yet to see any open source routing software that’s half usable as a complete package. With the sole exception of VyOS, it’s all hot garbage, OpenWRT and pfSense included.
    - wtallis 2y ago
      Ok, you may be in the wrong thread. This is a product for people who consider OpenWRT support to be a positive selling point. The OpenWRT One and OpenWRT Two are not products aimed at people who consider OpenWRT to be "hot garbage". They're not trying to produce generically good router hardware; they're trying to produce good router hardware for use with OpenWRT. When somebody in this context is asking for similar hardware, it's reasonable to assume that OpenWRT support would still be considered important, or at least worth mentioning.
    - facile3232 2y ago
      Oh that's surprising! Why do you consider VyOS to be less "hot garbage" than the others? That's a hell of a take!
  - ElectRabbit 2y ago
    Quite a few Ubiquiti APs can be reflashed with OpenWRT.
microtonal 2y ago
MicroTik is European (Latvian) and makes some affordable routers. Their own RouterOS is closed source, but many models are supported by OpenWrt (no experience). If you are willing to spend more, OPNsense (Netherlands) also sells hardware. In the old days one could also recommend PFsense hardware, but they are becoming more and more closed (though you can usually run OPNsense on the same hardware). QNAP is Taiwanese. Their QHora routers use closed software, but I think most models are supported by OpenWrt.
- ElectRabbit 2y ago
  I really love their Switches, Routers and directional radio link stuff. But: Mikrotik has problems with end-user Wifi - Their APs are old and weak.
- greggsy 2y ago
  Mikrotik devices compete in the mid-tier commercial and prosumer markets (the same market Unifi compete in). GL.Inet are firmly in the personal and budget enthusiast market. The price differences between those two markets is almost 2:1.
  - msh 2y ago
    What devices are you comparing? I don’t see anything near those price differences.
- u8080 2y ago
  I would like to avoid Mikrotik at all costs since they are not only running questionable proprietary software, but has a history of GPL violation. Currently they provide sources for GPL components this way, what a joke of a company: >To get a CD with the corresponding source code for the GPL-covered programs in this distribution, wire transfer $45 to MikroTikls SIA, Ūnijas iela 2, Riga, LV-1039, Latvia.
facile3232 2y ago
Similarly, I'd like one from outside both american/european AND chinese influence. I think you'd be absolutely insane to trust either of them. Honestly, if we're ever going to have a decent open hardware movement, I think it's going to come from a place like Nigeria or Peru, not a wealthy country.
a3w 2y ago
The west is now split, I have the same trust in China, as in US based companies.

In the absence of PC Engines (RIP) Swiss design made in Taiwan, there is the South Korean ODROID from https://hardkernel.com https://hardkernel.com. Compulab in Israel has some customizable IoT boards, https://www.compulab.com/products/sbcs/sbc-iot-imx8-nxp-i-mx8m-mini-internet-of-things-single-board-computer/ https://www.compulab.com/products/sbcs/sbc-iot-imx8-nxp-i-mx... QNAP in Taiwan has QHora routers, but much higher price points.

cycomanic 2y ago
The irony here is that it's the US who has been proven to break into allied networks and infrastructure and done both political and industrial espionage against their allies.
- walterbell 2y ago
  If global manufacturers would get with the program and ship blob-free hardware with mainline Linux support, owners could pick their desired firmware and software poison. Until then, we have Cambrian hardware innovation, old kernels and mystery firmware from Shenzen, which can be compromised by a broad spectrum of hostile actors.
- greggsy 2y ago
  I hope it isn't a surprise that every country with sufficient resources and motives will do it to everyone else.

squarefoot 2y ago

Mikrotik sells also bare boards. They come with their RouterOS platform (Linux based, closed) but some can run OpenWRT. Also Olimex has really interesting and open products, but they're not primarily aimed at networking. https://mikrotik.com/products/group/routerboard https://mikrotik.com/products/group/routerboard https://www.olimex.com/ https://www.olimex.com/

sgjohnson 2y ago

https://store.ui.com/us/en/category/all-cloud-gateways/products/udr7 https://store.ui.com/us/en/category/all-cloud-gateways/produ... 4x 2.5GbE (one of them even a PoE port) 1x 10GbE SFP+ WiFi 7 with MLO $279

microtonal 2y ago
Ubiquiti gear is great, but does not use open source software like OpenWrt Two. And I think most modern Ubiquiti routers are not supported by OpenWrt.
- sgjohnson 2y ago
  I don’t see how ubiquiti not being open source is relevant here, as the original question was > Can you recommend Western companies that would be able to produce similar hardware at the same price point? Besides, I’m yet to see any open source routing software that’s half usable as a complete package. With the sole exception of VyOS, it’s all hot garbage, OpenWRT and pfSense included.
  - wtallis 2y ago
    Ok, you may be in the wrong thread. This is a product for people who consider OpenWRT support to be a positive selling point. The OpenWRT One and OpenWRT Two are not products aimed at people who consider OpenWRT to be "hot garbage". They're not trying to produce generically good router hardware; they're trying to produce good router hardware for use with OpenWRT. When somebody in this context is asking for similar hardware, it's reasonable to assume that OpenWRT support would still be considered important, or at least worth mentioning.
  - facile3232 2y ago
    Oh that's surprising! Why do you consider VyOS to be less "hot garbage" than the others? That's a hell of a take!
- ElectRabbit 2y ago
  Quite a few Ubiquiti APs can be reflashed with OpenWRT.

microtonal 2y ago

MicroTik is European (Latvian) and makes some affordable routers. Their own RouterOS is closed source, but many models are supported by OpenWrt (no experience). If you are willing to spend more, OPNsense (Netherlands) also sells hardware. In the old days one could also recommend PFsense hardware, but they are becoming more and more closed (though you can usually run OPNsense on the same hardware). QNAP is Taiwanese. Their QHora routers use closed software, but I think most models are supported by OpenWrt.

ElectRabbit 2y ago
I really love their Switches, Routers and directional radio link stuff. But: Mikrotik has problems with end-user Wifi - Their APs are old and weak.
greggsy 2y ago
Mikrotik devices compete in the mid-tier commercial and prosumer markets (the same market Unifi compete in). GL.Inet are firmly in the personal and budget enthusiast market. The price differences between those two markets is almost 2:1.
- msh 2y ago
  What devices are you comparing? I don’t see anything near those price differences.
u8080 2y ago
I would like to avoid Mikrotik at all costs since they are not only running questionable proprietary software, but has a history of GPL violation. Currently they provide sources for GPL components this way, what a joke of a company: >To get a CD with the corresponding source code for the GPL-covered programs in this distribution, wire transfer $45 to MikroTikls SIA, Ūnijas iela 2, Riga, LV-1039, Latvia.

facile3232 2y ago

Similarly, I'd like one from outside both american/european AND chinese influence. I think you'd be absolutely insane to trust either of them. Honestly, if we're ever going to have a decent open hardware movement, I think it's going to come from a place like Nigeria or Peru, not a wealthy country.

a3w 2y ago

The west is now split, I have the same trust in China, as in US based companies.