5 ms·

Some of those cultures that apparently celebrate gay people were also chemically castrating them not that long ago, and also have a lot of locals who still hate

by hnhg 2y ago

Some of those cultures that apparently celebrate gay people were also chemically castrating them not that long ago, and also have a lot of locals who still hate gay people and cannot wait to get back to the old ways. The rise of the far right in Europe and USA might challenge your idea of fixed regional cultures quite soon.

tomp 2y ago
The main drive of who you call “far right” is precisely to import less people that want to throw gays off roofs.
- hnhg 2y ago
  Some of them, maybe. Some others are just not tolerant of LGBT lifestyles and equality at all. Also, I don't think someone who wants limited immigration is necessarily far right.
  - FirmwareBurner 2y ago
    *)limiting ILLEGAL immigration, emphasis on the word illegal. Nobody in Europe has a problem with LEGAL immigration, but the left wing parties and MSM keeps ignoring this and sweeping illegal immigration along the legal immigration banner to drive the narrative that Europeans are racists who hate all immigrants in order to justify (social) media censorship and restrictions on free speech to fight the "right wing extremist nazi" boogie man, which ironically, actually fuels the swing towards the extremist right wing, because the regular public discourse and communication channels for criticizing illegal immigration in public are censored/disabled.
    - amanaplanacanal 2y ago
      They always say that, until you talk about legalizing more immigration, then you find out that no, they don't want any more immigration period.
      - FirmwareBurner 2y ago
        >until you talk about legalizing more immigration Maybe because people have been duped so much in the last 10+ years to know that the loaded statement of "more immigration" from the government only means legalizing more ILLEGAL immigration, driving them to hate all forms of immigration because the governments have proven themselves useless at enforcing border controls and depurations of those who brake the law. That's the result that you get when you maliciously sweep ILLEGAL immigration under the same political banner used for legal immigration, as the liberal European governments have done, so you end up hurting the image of legal immigration as well but this is the fault of politicians, not the people whoa have suffered form illegal immigration and have next to no channels of changing this other than voting far right.
        amanaplanacanal 2y ago
        Ummm... At least in the US, they are absolutely not worried about law breaking at all. Look who they just elected president? "Law and order" is basically dead here.
        FirmwareBurner 2y ago
        Do you want the Orange Man to bring back all those prisoners he sent to EL Salvador? Would you like them in your neighborhood?
        amanaplanacanal 2y ago
        I just find it fascinating how some people are perfectly fine with rich criminals, but want to get rid of the poor criminals. It makes me wonder what their real motivations are.
        mantas 2y ago
        Crimes by random thugs is affecting day-to-day life much more than corrupt politicians stuffing their pockets with public money. Getting stabbed on the street vs somebody giving a government contract to a buddy? If I must choose, I’d rather take the later tbh.
    - decimalenough 2y ago
      A lot of people in Europe absolutely have a problem with legal immigration, with asylum seekers particularly maligned. Specifically, the rise of far-right parties in Scandinavia, Germany and France is very much a reaction to legal immigration from Arab and African countries. The argument is not "they're stealing our jobs", but "they're abusing our welfare benefits, driving up crime and raping our women".
      - FirmwareBurner 2y ago
        1) Not all asylum seekers are legal immigrants. Legal means you have obtained an entry visa before crossing the border. 2) Even huge amounts of legal asylum seekers can end up straining the already thin welfare state, so it's only normal that taxpayers paying for the welfare state, ask their politicians "where are you goanna house all these newly arrived asylum seekers when even citizens and taxpayers are struggling with housing?" or "how do you know all those unvetted people you're letting in aren't criminals or if they're compatible with our culture and values so that we and our children can feel safe in public?" So when politicians provide no answers to those questions, how are you surprised voters aren't taking this well and choosing the extreme right?
        decimalenough 2y ago
        I'm not sure who you're asking, but I'm not surprised at all.
        rat87 2y ago
        1) no it means legally seeking asylum under the legal process 2) Maybe build more housing? Maybe hire some of the new immigrants to build more housing. They're not unvetted because they are going through a vetting process. Statistically we know most aren't criminals.
      - absolutelastone 2y ago
        Is an asylum seeker really legal if their claim is a stretch and they are in fact just an economic migrant? Seems like an arguable category that should be treated separately. Though I agree there appear to be plenty of people in Europe who want to restrict legal immigration too. Is this taboo there now too?
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
like_any_other 2y ago
That same far right might challenge your idea of the far right. E.g. Germany's AfD is headed by a lesbian in a relationship with a Sri Lankan, and the party enjoys disproportionate support by gay men: https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/why-do-so-many-gay-men-support-the-afd/ https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/why-do-so-many-gay-men-s...
- defrost 2y ago
  In a world where Ernst Röhm, leader of the SA, the Nazi Party's stormtroopers, was openly gay, and Reich uniforms and Hugo Boss feature heavily in gay iconography ... that would suprise us why?
  - like_any_other 2y ago
    I was replying specifically to a post that equated the far right with anti-gay views. Ask them.
    - defrost 2y ago
      Fair point, I was chaining in general and not specifically having a go at yourself. People are complicated and there's no shortage of head scratching examples of seemingly mismatched fellow travellers.

by hnhg 2y ago

tomp 2y ago

The main drive of who you call “far right” is precisely to import less people that want to throw gays off roofs.

hnhg 2y ago
Some of them, maybe. Some others are just not tolerant of LGBT lifestyles and equality at all. Also, I don't think someone who wants limited immigration is necessarily far right.
- FirmwareBurner 2y ago
  *)limiting ILLEGAL immigration, emphasis on the word illegal. Nobody in Europe has a problem with LEGAL immigration, but the left wing parties and MSM keeps ignoring this and sweeping illegal immigration along the legal immigration banner to drive the narrative that Europeans are racists who hate all immigrants in order to justify (social) media censorship and restrictions on free speech to fight the "right wing extremist nazi" boogie man, which ironically, actually fuels the swing towards the extremist right wing, because the regular public discourse and communication channels for criticizing illegal immigration in public are censored/disabled.
  - amanaplanacanal 2y ago
    They always say that, until you talk about legalizing more immigration, then you find out that no, they don't want any more immigration period.
    - FirmwareBurner 2y ago
      >until you talk about legalizing more immigration Maybe because people have been duped so much in the last 10+ years to know that the loaded statement of "more immigration" from the government only means legalizing more ILLEGAL immigration, driving them to hate all forms of immigration because the governments have proven themselves useless at enforcing border controls and depurations of those who brake the law. That's the result that you get when you maliciously sweep ILLEGAL immigration under the same political banner used for legal immigration, as the liberal European governments have done, so you end up hurting the image of legal immigration as well but this is the fault of politicians, not the people whoa have suffered form illegal immigration and have next to no channels of changing this other than voting far right.
      - amanaplanacanal 2y ago
        Ummm... At least in the US, they are absolutely not worried about law breaking at all. Look who they just elected president? "Law and order" is basically dead here.
        FirmwareBurner 2y ago
        Do you want the Orange Man to bring back all those prisoners he sent to EL Salvador? Would you like them in your neighborhood?
        amanaplanacanal 2y ago
        I just find it fascinating how some people are perfectly fine with rich criminals, but want to get rid of the poor criminals. It makes me wonder what their real motivations are.
        mantas 2y ago
        Crimes by random thugs is affecting day-to-day life much more than corrupt politicians stuffing their pockets with public money. Getting stabbed on the street vs somebody giving a government contract to a buddy? If I must choose, I’d rather take the later tbh.
  - decimalenough 2y ago
    A lot of people in Europe absolutely have a problem with legal immigration, with asylum seekers particularly maligned. Specifically, the rise of far-right parties in Scandinavia, Germany and France is very much a reaction to legal immigration from Arab and African countries. The argument is not "they're stealing our jobs", but "they're abusing our welfare benefits, driving up crime and raping our women".
    - FirmwareBurner 2y ago
      1) Not all asylum seekers are legal immigrants. Legal means you have obtained an entry visa before crossing the border. 2) Even huge amounts of legal asylum seekers can end up straining the already thin welfare state, so it's only normal that taxpayers paying for the welfare state, ask their politicians "where are you goanna house all these newly arrived asylum seekers when even citizens and taxpayers are struggling with housing?" or "how do you know all those unvetted people you're letting in aren't criminals or if they're compatible with our culture and values so that we and our children can feel safe in public?" So when politicians provide no answers to those questions, how are you surprised voters aren't taking this well and choosing the extreme right?
      - decimalenough 2y ago
        I'm not sure who you're asking, but I'm not surprised at all.
      - rat87 2y ago
        1) no it means legally seeking asylum under the legal process 2) Maybe build more housing? Maybe hire some of the new immigrants to build more housing. They're not unvetted because they are going through a vetting process. Statistically we know most aren't criminals.
    - absolutelastone 2y ago
      Is an asylum seeker really legal if their claim is a stretch and they are in fact just an economic migrant? Seems like an arguable category that should be treated separately. Though I agree there appear to be plenty of people in Europe who want to restrict legal immigration too. Is this taboo there now too?
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]

like_any_other 2y ago

That same far right might challenge your idea of the far right. E.g. Germany's AfD is headed by a lesbian in a relationship with a Sri Lankan, and the party enjoys disproportionate support by gay men: https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/why-do-so-many-gay-men-support-the-afd/ https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/why-do-so-many-gay-men-s...

defrost 2y ago
In a world where Ernst Röhm, leader of the SA, the Nazi Party's stormtroopers, was openly gay, and Reich uniforms and Hugo Boss feature heavily in gay iconography ... that would suprise us why?
- like_any_other 2y ago
  I was replying specifically to a post that equated the far right with anti-gay views. Ask them.
  - defrost 2y ago
    Fair point, I was chaining in general and not specifically having a go at yourself. People are complicated and there's no shortage of head scratching examples of seemingly mismatched fellow travellers.