4 ms·

Say what you want about Apple, at least somewhere in the org they have people both able and willing to say “I don’t care why you think it’s necessary, that’s st

Say what you want about Apple, at least somewhere in the org they have people both able and willing to say “I don’t care why you think it’s necessary, that’s stupid and confusing and you’re not doing it”. Whereas at Microsoft apparently when someone proposes 6 different apps with the same name, whoever should say no just raises their hand with a thumbs up without looking up from their phone.

nixass 2y ago
How do you explain iOS' settings app then?
- mrweasel 2y ago
  And once every iOS user was sufficiently confused about their settings, to the point where they where afraid to touch the settings app, out of fear that they might change something and never be able to figure out how to change it back, Apple replaced the macOS settings app with the iOS one. Thereby allowing desktop users to experience the hardship and mind numbing confusion that is the iOS settings app. I hate settings on iOS so much. What a horrible broken shitshow that is.
  - egypturnash 2y ago
    The only way to use any Apple settings app now, IMHO is to search for what you want. Even if it's something you have visited countless times before it's faster than squinting at the long, long column of tiny icons. I miss the big friendly grid of icons so much.
  - mfro 2y ago
    I genuinely don’t understand this sentiment. It seems perfectly fine to me. I can understand how a non-technical user would get confused, but I appreciate the granularity.
    - mrweasel 2y ago
      My mother-in-law came by, her phone has switched to "dark mode", because she accidentally did something in settings. There is no way for any regular user to find out that that was not what had happened. She accidentally switched an accessibility feature, but you have to know that that is a thing to even begin to locate it and there are multiple feature that does something similar. The granularity isn't the issue, the discoverability is.
  - pndy 2y ago
    Is this interface that much different from "classic" OSX preferences? The old panel with horizontal icons was replaced with sidebar tree which loads sections withouth need to return to main screen - that is pretty much convenient. But I do agree - settings panels not only in OSX become too complex and often featuring stuff that should stay on mobile devices. It's been years but I'm still not fond of all sorts of notification centers and destkop applications being able to nag you with their stuff.
    - cosmotic 2y ago
      On top of the list vs grid, it was reorganized into multiple layers, universally understood controls were replaced with new ones never used on macos before, universally appreciated design elements like containment boxes were removed, native controls were (at least in some places) replaced with web-based look-alikes, recognizable ucons were replaced, decades-old terms were replaced...
  - sockaddr 2y ago
    I have a hard time understanding this. I can agree that things in macOS/iOS settings may be broken or unintuitive or whatever (I have no examples but I'll believe you). But a shitshow? No. Window's Control Panel is a shitshow. What I'd like to know from you is, if macOS/iOS settings isn't the closest thing to perfect, what is? My Gnome settings control panel on my main desktop is a certified shitshow. But macOS/iOS? Nah
    - mrweasel 2y ago
      The old macOS settings wasn't perfect, but it was much better. On iOS, I don't know, I think it's just a very hard problem. iOS has a ton of settings, but honestly the only way to fix the settings app on iOS is perhaps to start removing features.
- SSLy 2y ago
  Admittedly the iCloud section is confusing, otherwise it's the least worst OS settings app I've seen.
- nullpoint420 2y ago
  I had no idea iOS had Settings (New), Settings (Classic), and Apple Preferences - all competing for user share just like Outlook (New), Outlook (Classic), and Windows Mail are. /s
  - vizzier 2y ago
    Un-sarcastically though, you're also describing the windows 11 settings pane. Which arguably has settings (new style) control pannel (old style) and various *.msc management consoles for managing things like users and local security policy
- bathtub365 2y ago
  Well, there’s only one settings app at least, which is also different than what Microsoft does.
LeoPanthera 2y ago
There are four, possibly five distinct products called "Apple TV", including hardware, software, and a service.
- lotsofpulp 2y ago
  Apple TV : device that connects to your TV (Apple) TV app : program that lets you access video media sold by Apple and other streaming services that let Apple index their media (which is all except Netflix) Apple TV+ : subscription service to access video media produced by Apple While not the most clear situation, it’s not too bad, in my opinion.
  - ak_111 2y ago
    The way you described TV app and Apple TV+ makes it sound that they are identical or am I missing the difference?
    - LeoPanthera 2y ago
      The TV app also plays local video purchased from the iTunes Store (which still exists) or imported by the user.
      - SSLy 2y ago
        For the other apps that support the special API, it can also be a portal to jump straight into their content. Depending on your region, Netflix, Disney+, and Amazon Prime might allow that.
    - dabbz 2y ago
      You access your Apple TV+ subscription via the TV App lol.
    - lotsofpulp 2y ago
      I edited it to make it a little more clear, but I can see the confusion. Apple sells media that others produce, but they also sell subscription only access to media that they themselves produce. So movies and tv shows that you “buy” (really, rent for as long as Apple allows you to access it) can be accessed via the TV app. Basically, the stuff where Comcast or Disney or Sony or Warner Bros gets paid 70% and Apple gets a 30% commission. But for things Apple directly produces (or buys and then re-sells), they require customers to pay an ongoing fee for Apple TV+. Also, LeoPanthera is right that the TV app can also be your library for your own files that you import, and then you can synchronize that to your phone or iPad’s tv app.
surgical_fire 2y ago
How cute, you think Apple cares about the steaming pile of shit Mac OS is.
iAMkenough 2y ago
As I comment from my iPhone XR Plus Air Max Ultra Extreme, it always annoyed me the 3rd generation of the iPad was officially named "the new iPad" in 2012, replacing the iPad 2. I have "the new iPad" in a drawer, but its last software update was released in 2016. It's not very "new" anymore, but that's its official name.

nixass 2y ago

How do you explain iOS' settings app then?

mrweasel 2y ago
And once every iOS user was sufficiently confused about their settings, to the point where they where afraid to touch the settings app, out of fear that they might change something and never be able to figure out how to change it back, Apple replaced the macOS settings app with the iOS one. Thereby allowing desktop users to experience the hardship and mind numbing confusion that is the iOS settings app. I hate settings on iOS so much. What a horrible broken shitshow that is.
- egypturnash 2y ago
  The only way to use any Apple settings app now, IMHO is to search for what you want. Even if it's something you have visited countless times before it's faster than squinting at the long, long column of tiny icons. I miss the big friendly grid of icons so much.
- mfro 2y ago
  I genuinely don’t understand this sentiment. It seems perfectly fine to me. I can understand how a non-technical user would get confused, but I appreciate the granularity.
  - mrweasel 2y ago
    My mother-in-law came by, her phone has switched to "dark mode", because she accidentally did something in settings. There is no way for any regular user to find out that that was not what had happened. She accidentally switched an accessibility feature, but you have to know that that is a thing to even begin to locate it and there are multiple feature that does something similar. The granularity isn't the issue, the discoverability is.
- pndy 2y ago
  Is this interface that much different from "classic" OSX preferences? The old panel with horizontal icons was replaced with sidebar tree which loads sections withouth need to return to main screen - that is pretty much convenient. But I do agree - settings panels not only in OSX become too complex and often featuring stuff that should stay on mobile devices. It's been years but I'm still not fond of all sorts of notification centers and destkop applications being able to nag you with their stuff.
  - cosmotic 2y ago
    On top of the list vs grid, it was reorganized into multiple layers, universally understood controls were replaced with new ones never used on macos before, universally appreciated design elements like containment boxes were removed, native controls were (at least in some places) replaced with web-based look-alikes, recognizable ucons were replaced, decades-old terms were replaced...
- sockaddr 2y ago
  I have a hard time understanding this. I can agree that things in macOS/iOS settings may be broken or unintuitive or whatever (I have no examples but I'll believe you). But a shitshow? No. Window's Control Panel is a shitshow. What I'd like to know from you is, if macOS/iOS settings isn't the closest thing to perfect, what is? My Gnome settings control panel on my main desktop is a certified shitshow. But macOS/iOS? Nah
  - mrweasel 2y ago
    The old macOS settings wasn't perfect, but it was much better. On iOS, I don't know, I think it's just a very hard problem. iOS has a ton of settings, but honestly the only way to fix the settings app on iOS is perhaps to start removing features.
SSLy 2y ago
Admittedly the iCloud section is confusing, otherwise it's the least worst OS settings app I've seen.
nullpoint420 2y ago
I had no idea iOS had Settings (New), Settings (Classic), and Apple Preferences - all competing for user share just like Outlook (New), Outlook (Classic), and Windows Mail are. /s
- vizzier 2y ago
  Un-sarcastically though, you're also describing the windows 11 settings pane. Which arguably has settings (new style) control pannel (old style) and various *.msc management consoles for managing things like users and local security policy
bathtub365 2y ago
Well, there’s only one settings app at least, which is also different than what Microsoft does.

LeoPanthera 2y ago

There are four, possibly five distinct products called "Apple TV", including hardware, software, and a service.

lotsofpulp 2y ago
Apple TV : device that connects to your TV (Apple) TV app : program that lets you access video media sold by Apple and other streaming services that let Apple index their media (which is all except Netflix) Apple TV+ : subscription service to access video media produced by Apple While not the most clear situation, it’s not too bad, in my opinion.
- ak_111 2y ago
  The way you described TV app and Apple TV+ makes it sound that they are identical or am I missing the difference?
  - LeoPanthera 2y ago
    The TV app also plays local video purchased from the iTunes Store (which still exists) or imported by the user.
    - SSLy 2y ago
      For the other apps that support the special API, it can also be a portal to jump straight into their content. Depending on your region, Netflix, Disney+, and Amazon Prime might allow that.
  - dabbz 2y ago
    You access your Apple TV+ subscription via the TV App lol.
  - lotsofpulp 2y ago
    I edited it to make it a little more clear, but I can see the confusion. Apple sells media that others produce, but they also sell subscription only access to media that they themselves produce. So movies and tv shows that you “buy” (really, rent for as long as Apple allows you to access it) can be accessed via the TV app. Basically, the stuff where Comcast or Disney or Sony or Warner Bros gets paid 70% and Apple gets a 30% commission. But for things Apple directly produces (or buys and then re-sells), they require customers to pay an ongoing fee for Apple TV+. Also, LeoPanthera is right that the TV app can also be your library for your own files that you import, and then you can synchronize that to your phone or iPad’s tv app.

surgical_fire 2y ago

How cute, you think Apple cares about the steaming pile of shit Mac OS is.

iAMkenough 2y ago

As I comment from my iPhone XR Plus Air Max Ultra Extreme, it always annoyed me the 3rd generation of the iPad was officially named "the new iPad" in 2012, replacing the iPad 2. I have "the new iPad" in a drawer, but its last software update was released in 2016. It's not very "new" anymore, but that's its official name.