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> There is nothing in this verse which says that property is to be expropriated for the purposes of assuring others a particular standard of living, and I don’t

> There is nothing in this verse which says that property is to be expropriated for the purposes of assuring others a particular standard of living, and I don’t think you’ll be able to find one. You're right; we have the free will to be as miserly as we choose. But if you want to be of Christ, you'll give your 5% or 10%, at least. Our societies also have the free will to choose to tax the rich to help the poor. A govt run by actual Christians would not let the rich trample the poor and our shared environment, our human family's inheritance and future. Yes, everyone is free to be a selfish asshole -- "there is not compulsion in religion" is God's command, too -- but our govt should reflect the generosity of spirit we are called to manifest. If you don't like the taxes, find another place to ply your wares. > You’ve ignored my question. If Jesus is God, and God rewarded Job with material wealth in this world, how can Jesus be said to offer an unambiguous criticism of wealth? If one has acquired it by cheating or abusing others or selling harmful products or without paying one's fair tax rate, then those are ill-gotten gains are bad for the person who chose to live that way and bad for the society they are parasitizing. So, yes, God's Messengers of love can have whatever beneficience our Lord bestows upon them, but it will not be ill-gotten and it will not be for the selfish pleasure and will never be wasted, for "God does not love the wasters". Most of all, what is important to remember is that we cannot love both God and money, i.e. we cannot serve two masters. We must be generous with others out of love for them, and be grateful to God that we have been granted God's generosity to have better circumstances. To love someone means wanting them to be happy. Any kind of "love" that does not result in effortful action -- i.e. actual service -- for the other person is nothing but empty words, and we must live the truth of God's teachings of love. "Love thy neighbor as your own self." Not more, not less. We are given the choice in money matters and it is a sore trial for most human beings. But God's teachings of love are clear as day to those with eyes to see, ears to hear, and a heart that understands.

lurk2 2y ago
> but our govt should reflect the generosity of spirit we are called to manifest. The whole notion of state welfare necessarily involves the forcible expropriation of property, resistance to which is punishable by death. If I took $20 out of your wallet and gave it to someone else who I thought needed it more, it would not be charity, it would be theft. > i.e. we cannot serve two masters This was never suggested. Wealth is a tool. Where it becomes fetishized as an end in and of itself, it becomes objectionable. You'll note that the device you're using to post in this thread is in all likelihood worth more than most people on earth earn in a year. Is your soul in danger because you own a laptop, or is there more nuance to this issue than you're suggesting?
- MrMcCall 2y ago
  > involves the forcible expropriation of property If you don't want to live in that society, move somewhere else. That's your free choice, too, but I counsel against it. Are you directly choosing to help maintain roads, and hospitals, and everything else that helps society function? No, but your taxes are. > Is your soul in danger because you own a laptop, or is there more nuance to this issue than you're suggesting? Nuance is lost on you, my friend. If you think that the poor should just be left to their own devices, then you're bound to learn a painful lesson or three in this life. Those with no compassion should be prepared to deal with those who have no compassion for them. Mayhaps you won't realize this until you are left with no other options but enduring the pain of being under the power of people who have no concern for your well-being. I hope you have a kinder fate than that, but you shall reap what you sow, my friend, as we all do, in time. I am explaining these things for your benefit, not mine. You should reach beyond your current perspective and realize that I am only here for your benefit. We love you, and only want you to be happy, too.
  - lurk2 2y ago
    > I am explaining these things for your benefit, not mine. You haven’t explained anything. Get over yourself.

lurk2 2y ago

> but our govt should reflect the generosity of spirit we are called to manifest. The whole notion of state welfare necessarily involves the forcible expropriation of property, resistance to which is punishable by death. If I took $20 out of your wallet and gave it to someone else who I thought needed it more, it would not be charity, it would be theft. > i.e. we cannot serve two masters This was never suggested. Wealth is a tool. Where it becomes fetishized as an end in and of itself, it becomes objectionable. You'll note that the device you're using to post in this thread is in all likelihood worth more than most people on earth earn in a year. Is your soul in danger because you own a laptop, or is there more nuance to this issue than you're suggesting?

MrMcCall 2y ago
> involves the forcible expropriation of property If you don't want to live in that society, move somewhere else. That's your free choice, too, but I counsel against it. Are you directly choosing to help maintain roads, and hospitals, and everything else that helps society function? No, but your taxes are. > Is your soul in danger because you own a laptop, or is there more nuance to this issue than you're suggesting? Nuance is lost on you, my friend. If you think that the poor should just be left to their own devices, then you're bound to learn a painful lesson or three in this life. Those with no compassion should be prepared to deal with those who have no compassion for them. Mayhaps you won't realize this until you are left with no other options but enduring the pain of being under the power of people who have no concern for your well-being. I hope you have a kinder fate than that, but you shall reap what you sow, my friend, as we all do, in time. I am explaining these things for your benefit, not mine. You should reach beyond your current perspective and realize that I am only here for your benefit. We love you, and only want you to be happy, too.
- lurk2 2y ago
  > I am explaining these things for your benefit, not mine. You haven’t explained anything. Get over yourself.