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As a European, I would like nothing more than for our ruling elites to stop acting like petulant teenagers that are upset that their parents voted Republican an

As a European, I would like nothing more than for our ruling elites to stop acting like petulant teenagers that are upset that their parents voted Republican and instead move out and start supporting themselves. For decades here in Norway we have had talks about how we need to denuclearize, stop all industry, stop all energy production, stop all mining. This, if not directly a result of Russian interference, is at least something Russia and China are entirely behind. They would love nothing more than to see their rivals self-destruct. European alternatives are not great. That is just a fact. I want them to be great. As Donald Tusk said, it's insane that Europe is expecting the much smaller US to defend it against the even smaller Russia. The time has come to stop acting like petulant teenagers rebelling and start acting like adults. All of this also ignores the fact that Europe jails people for thought crime at a much higher rate than US or even Russia. And European countries are much more draconian with trying to restrict privacy and encryption. Right now, my data is more private in US than in most of Europe.

fransje26 2y ago
> that Europe jails people for thought crime at a much higher rate than US or even Russia > Right now, my data is more private in US than in most of Europe. Could follow the train of thought until it catastrophically derailed in the last three sentences..
- flanked-evergl 2y ago
  Both facts. EU is pushing for an end-to-end to end encryption and there is no freedom of expression in Europe. Norway tried to jail a lesbian for believing that men can't become women. You may disagree with her, but it's ridiculous that she should be in jail for her view. Scotland makes it illegal to pray silently in your own home in some cases. UK already makes it illegal to pray silently in your own head. How much more draconian can you get?
  - fransje26 2y ago
    > Both facts. EU is pushing for an end-to-end to end encryption No. Some actors are pushing for an end of end-to-end encryption, which doesn't mean it's an EU fact. In fact, it just got rejected in the French parliament. > Norway tried to jail a lesbian No. A person got investigate for hate-speech, which is perfectly within the bounds of "freedom of speech". The fact that she did not go to prison shows the system works as intended. > Scotland makes it illegal to pray silently in your own home > UK already makes it illegal to pray in your own home. No. Debunked as nonsense.
    - flanked-evergl 2y ago
      European Threat To End-To-End Encryption Would Invade Phones https://www.forbes.com/sites/digital-assets/2024/05/07/european-threat-to-end-to-end-encryption-would-invade-phones/ https://www.forbes.com/sites/digital-assets/2024/05/07/europ... European Police Chiefs call for industry and governments to take action against end-to-end encryption roll-out https://www.europol.europa.eu/media-press/newsroom/news/european-police-chiefs-call-for-industry-and-governments-to-take-action-against-end-to-end-encryption-roll-out https://www.europol.europa.eu/media-press/newsroom/news/euro... Norwegian actress Tonje Gjevjon faces up to 3 years in prison for saying men cannot be lesbians https://nypost.com/2022/12/15/tonje-gjevjon-faces-up-to-3-years-in-prison-for-saying-men-cannot-be-lesbians/ https://nypost.com/2022/12/15/tonje-gjevjon-faces-up-to-3-ye... British Man Convicted of Criminal Charges for Praying Silently Near Abortion Clinic https://reason.com/2024/10/17/british-man-convicted-of-criminal-charges-for-praying-silently-near-abortion-clinic/ https://reason.com/2024/10/17/british-man-convicted-of-crimi...
      - avh02 2y ago
        you went from "in your own home" to "near abortion clinic" real quick. And abortion clinics IIRC are an area protected from protests or something along those lines. The man knew. He was told multiple times. He didn't have to pray there. Pretty sure big man upstairs wouldn't mind if he went a few meters down the street. edit, source: https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c4g9kp7r00vo https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c4g9kp7r00vo further edit: i see said "in your own head", yes, it is in your own head, but the intention is intimidating to those who want healthcare. Pretty sure prayer is not localized.
dxuh 2y ago
> All of this also ignores the fact that Europe jails people for thought crime at a much higher rate than US or even Russia. This sounds crazy to me and I have trouble believing it. I tried to find sources, but could not. As you were mentioning rates i.e. numbers, I am sure you have some source for this? The fact alone that hate-speech and holocaust-denial laws exist is not sufficient.

fransje26 2y ago

> that Europe jails people for thought crime at a much higher rate than US or even Russia > Right now, my data is more private in US than in most of Europe. Could follow the train of thought until it catastrophically derailed in the last three sentences..

flanked-evergl 2y ago
Both facts. EU is pushing for an end-to-end to end encryption and there is no freedom of expression in Europe. Norway tried to jail a lesbian for believing that men can't become women. You may disagree with her, but it's ridiculous that she should be in jail for her view. Scotland makes it illegal to pray silently in your own home in some cases. UK already makes it illegal to pray silently in your own head. How much more draconian can you get?
- fransje26 2y ago
  > Both facts. EU is pushing for an end-to-end to end encryption No. Some actors are pushing for an end of end-to-end encryption, which doesn't mean it's an EU fact. In fact, it just got rejected in the French parliament. > Norway tried to jail a lesbian No. A person got investigate for hate-speech, which is perfectly within the bounds of "freedom of speech". The fact that she did not go to prison shows the system works as intended. > Scotland makes it illegal to pray silently in your own home > UK already makes it illegal to pray in your own home. No. Debunked as nonsense.
  - flanked-evergl 2y ago
    European Threat To End-To-End Encryption Would Invade Phones https://www.forbes.com/sites/digital-assets/2024/05/07/european-threat-to-end-to-end-encryption-would-invade-phones/ https://www.forbes.com/sites/digital-assets/2024/05/07/europ... European Police Chiefs call for industry and governments to take action against end-to-end encryption roll-out https://www.europol.europa.eu/media-press/newsroom/news/european-police-chiefs-call-for-industry-and-governments-to-take-action-against-end-to-end-encryption-roll-out https://www.europol.europa.eu/media-press/newsroom/news/euro... Norwegian actress Tonje Gjevjon faces up to 3 years in prison for saying men cannot be lesbians https://nypost.com/2022/12/15/tonje-gjevjon-faces-up-to-3-years-in-prison-for-saying-men-cannot-be-lesbians/ https://nypost.com/2022/12/15/tonje-gjevjon-faces-up-to-3-ye... British Man Convicted of Criminal Charges for Praying Silently Near Abortion Clinic https://reason.com/2024/10/17/british-man-convicted-of-criminal-charges-for-praying-silently-near-abortion-clinic/ https://reason.com/2024/10/17/british-man-convicted-of-crimi...
    - avh02 2y ago
      you went from "in your own home" to "near abortion clinic" real quick. And abortion clinics IIRC are an area protected from protests or something along those lines. The man knew. He was told multiple times. He didn't have to pray there. Pretty sure big man upstairs wouldn't mind if he went a few meters down the street. edit, source: https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c4g9kp7r00vo https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/c4g9kp7r00vo further edit: i see said "in your own head", yes, it is in your own head, but the intention is intimidating to those who want healthcare. Pretty sure prayer is not localized.

dxuh 2y ago

> All of this also ignores the fact that Europe jails people for thought crime at a much higher rate than US or even Russia. This sounds crazy to me and I have trouble believing it. I tried to find sources, but could not. As you were mentioning rates i.e. numbers, I am sure you have some source for this? The fact alone that hate-speech and holocaust-denial laws exist is not sufficient.