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No, the assumption is that search warrant protections are part of the American law system (they are) but that the legal requirements around them are routinely i

No, the assumption is that search warrant protections are part of the American law system (they are) but that the legal requirements around them are routinely ignored in America (they are) with arm waving and the term 'good faith', making the American system not a predictable system that follows it's rules, but one that is bent by judges around police 'failure' to follow the rules. The French system can be completely different, but, if you follow the logic of the law, it's matches what happens in practice, it's a valid legal system. The USA does not have that, because while it pretends warrant are required in actuality they aren't and requirements/protections for citizens can be waived away by judges under 'good faith'.

tptacek 2y ago
This to me reads as an argument that no protections are better than protections applied inconsistently. Maybe on a message board, but if I was a defendant, it seems like the decision between the two would be easy to make.
- Lerc 2y ago
  Marginalised groups have argued for removal of protections because of inconsistent application. If the application is inconsistent the marginalised are the ones who suffer from that inconsistency. Those with the power to fix the underlying issues tend to be beneficiaries of that inconsistency, giving them little incentive to make changes. Frequently they don't even perceive there to be a problem because while inconsistent application is theoretically possible, their experience suggests that it just doesn't happen that often. So many times people rail against a wealthy person who gets off lightly from some offense because their representatives have successfully argued that a punishment would be unduly harsh, or that there were particular mitigating circumstances. I usually disagree with people demanding a tougher punishment, but that is a similar principle at play. Personally I would rather have all persons charged to receive dispensation for circumstances rather than only a few elites. Similarly given the choice I'd want protections against illegal search and seizure to be for all, but when you have no power to make that happen, what is the best second option? A privileged subset, or everyone universally worse off?
  - tptacek 2y ago
    Removal of protections because of inconsistent application sounds dumb.
    - Lerc 2y ago
      Not if the inconsistency means the protection never really applied to you but the protection for others acted as hindrance to amending the system to providing a consistent protection.

tptacek 2y ago

This to me reads as an argument that no protections are better than protections applied inconsistently. Maybe on a message board, but if I was a defendant, it seems like the decision between the two would be easy to make.

Lerc 2y ago
Marginalised groups have argued for removal of protections because of inconsistent application. If the application is inconsistent the marginalised are the ones who suffer from that inconsistency. Those with the power to fix the underlying issues tend to be beneficiaries of that inconsistency, giving them little incentive to make changes. Frequently they don't even perceive there to be a problem because while inconsistent application is theoretically possible, their experience suggests that it just doesn't happen that often. So many times people rail against a wealthy person who gets off lightly from some offense because their representatives have successfully argued that a punishment would be unduly harsh, or that there were particular mitigating circumstances. I usually disagree with people demanding a tougher punishment, but that is a similar principle at play. Personally I would rather have all persons charged to receive dispensation for circumstances rather than only a few elites. Similarly given the choice I'd want protections against illegal search and seizure to be for all, but when you have no power to make that happen, what is the best second option? A privileged subset, or everyone universally worse off?
- tptacek 2y ago
  Removal of protections because of inconsistent application sounds dumb.
  - Lerc 2y ago
    Not if the inconsistency means the protection never really applied to you but the protection for others acted as hindrance to amending the system to providing a consistent protection.