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This is not surprising at all to the people who have looked at other cities that have implemented it. These were all expected outcomes, and I'm glad the expecta

This is not surprising at all to the people who have looked at other cities that have implemented it. These were all expected outcomes, and I'm glad the expectations turned into reality. One thing I'd like to add in is that to take public transit in NYC, you have to pay $2.90 a ride (with some exceptions). So for a commuter from the Bronx who works downtown, their daily fee is $5.80. A $9 a day fee to get into downtown with a car seems like a fair deal.

precommunicator 2y ago
Are there no much cheaper monthly/yearly tickets for commuters?
- etblg 2y ago
  For the MTA you cross a weekly threshold of 12 rides where rides after that are free: https://omny.info/fares https://omny.info/fares You max out paying $34 a week, or $17 if you qualify for reduced fare.
  - precommunicator 2y ago
    So that's not cheaper for someone who works 5 days a week and gets to their place of work with a single ride.
    - deleted 2y ago
      [deleted]
    - estebank 2y ago
      But it makes it free to use public transport on top of that: it encourages people to use it for more than commutes (improving traffic in turn), which makes sense because commutes are peak utilisation time, the rolling stock is under utilized at every other time.
      - 7speter 2y ago
        Have you tried using the subway during rush hour to get home in NYC? If you’re going in the same general direction as everyone else, it was already packed long before congestion pricing. The MTA is 50 billion+ in debt, and it will cost billions more to add capacity over decades.
    - yo_ean 2y ago
      The subway fare includes the cost of energy to get there and parking.
      - ty6853 2y ago
        That seems doubtful but possible since fares of public transit tend to run at a loss. Most public transit just offloaded the cost on poor who must drive to less accessible and less wealthy unserviced areas as collected tax expenditures from their checks.
        stouset 2y ago
        Your mind is going to be blown when you find out how much it costs to own and operate a car, not to mention how much it costs in terms of time to commute back and forth.
        ty6853 2y ago
        Sure, you have to pay for public road parasitism by pedestrian, public transit on roads funded partially by fuel taxes, and heavy road destroying vehicles. Not that I blame them, they're taking advantage of incentives offered. Who wouldn't want to bike on a road funded by car owners and then buy goods transported by 18 wheelers that end up destroying the road disproportionately to the point it is small passenger cars that get the biggest squeeze. It's not dumb to not want to be the sucker, the urban yuppies on transit routes are great at squeezing the working class that way.
        stouset 2y ago
        Roads are overwhelmingly funded by property taxes. Try again.
        ty6853 2y ago
        Property taxes are regressive tax, analogous but not equal to the way sales tax is, try again.
    - casta 2y ago
      I work 5 days a week and get to work on a single ride. I do take multiple other rides a day and in the weekend though, so I hit 12 rides pretty quickly, probably in around 4 days.
    - rsoto2 2y ago
      The benefit is not just "cheaper" it's more safety, faster commutes, better infrastructure investments and tax revenue.
- almostgotcaught 2y ago
  Of course there are - an unlimited metro card is $132. the person you're responding to is nuts - no one that commutes from Bronx to downtown is paying per swipe.
  - precommunicator 2y ago
    So assuming two rides in each working day that's still $6.42 per day
    - ceejayoz 2y ago
      Assuming you don't take any non-work rides, ever.
    - evanelias 2y ago
      That's a bad assumption, since NYC residents tend to use the subway for non-work-related travel as well.
    - almostgotcaught 2y ago
      As mentioned, you hop on a train to do anything/everything. In a single weekend you might take 10 rides. Edit: well if you live in a part of the city that has good coverage - up in the Bronx it's not so great naturally so I wouldn't be surprised if those people didn't get as much value out of a monthly card.
      - bobthepanda 2y ago
        But those people can still use local buses to get around on the exact same pass. So they could feasibly hit the cap anyways.
        almostgotcaught 2y ago
        true!
  - switch007 2y ago
jeffbee 2y ago
The whole game in 21st-century American governance is selling obvious solutions to unwilling bad-faith deniers. It doesn't really matter that is was obvious all along that congestion pricing was going to work. It doesn't matter that building homes obviously solves homelessness.
- jampekka 2y ago
  There are many quite obvious alternatives to congestion pricing. E.g. banning (private) vehicles from roads, or having fewer parking spaces or decreasing speed limits. These would also affect people quite equally regardless of how much money they have. With congestion pricing you actually incentivize driving for the wealthy enough.
  - jakelazaroff 2y ago
    The same constituencies that oppose congestion pricing also oppose the things you're describing. When the Adams administration effectively ended curbside dining, they were the people telling us that it was an improvement to replace tables for a dozen people with a parking spot for one SUV. The only way we were even able to get congestion pricing passed was by tying it to MTA funding.
    - jampekka 2y ago
      You can oppose congestion pricing but still support restricting driving. Funding MTA more in no way requires congestion pricing. The earmark is mostly a sharade.
      - jakelazaroff 2y ago
        Of course it's possible to hold both of those views. I'm just telling you what happens in practice.
    - 7speter 2y ago
      Have you paid for dining in Manhattan lately? The people who can afford dining in Manhattan and the people who want street parking for their 100k SUV are different sides of the same cohort, generally.

precommunicator 2y ago

Are there no much cheaper monthly/yearly tickets for commuters?

etblg 2y ago
For the MTA you cross a weekly threshold of 12 rides where rides after that are free: https://omny.info/fares https://omny.info/fares You max out paying $34 a week, or $17 if you qualify for reduced fare.
- precommunicator 2y ago
  So that's not cheaper for someone who works 5 days a week and gets to their place of work with a single ride.
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
  - estebank 2y ago
    But it makes it free to use public transport on top of that: it encourages people to use it for more than commutes (improving traffic in turn), which makes sense because commutes are peak utilisation time, the rolling stock is under utilized at every other time.
    - 7speter 2y ago
      Have you tried using the subway during rush hour to get home in NYC? If you’re going in the same general direction as everyone else, it was already packed long before congestion pricing. The MTA is 50 billion+ in debt, and it will cost billions more to add capacity over decades.
  - yo_ean 2y ago
    The subway fare includes the cost of energy to get there and parking.
    - ty6853 2y ago
      That seems doubtful but possible since fares of public transit tend to run at a loss. Most public transit just offloaded the cost on poor who must drive to less accessible and less wealthy unserviced areas as collected tax expenditures from their checks.
      - stouset 2y ago
        Your mind is going to be blown when you find out how much it costs to own and operate a car, not to mention how much it costs in terms of time to commute back and forth.
        ty6853 2y ago
        Sure, you have to pay for public road parasitism by pedestrian, public transit on roads funded partially by fuel taxes, and heavy road destroying vehicles. Not that I blame them, they're taking advantage of incentives offered. Who wouldn't want to bike on a road funded by car owners and then buy goods transported by 18 wheelers that end up destroying the road disproportionately to the point it is small passenger cars that get the biggest squeeze. It's not dumb to not want to be the sucker, the urban yuppies on transit routes are great at squeezing the working class that way.
        stouset 2y ago
        Roads are overwhelmingly funded by property taxes. Try again.
        ty6853 2y ago
        Property taxes are regressive tax, analogous but not equal to the way sales tax is, try again.
  - casta 2y ago
    I work 5 days a week and get to work on a single ride. I do take multiple other rides a day and in the weekend though, so I hit 12 rides pretty quickly, probably in around 4 days.
  - rsoto2 2y ago
    The benefit is not just "cheaper" it's more safety, faster commutes, better infrastructure investments and tax revenue.
almostgotcaught 2y ago
Of course there are - an unlimited metro card is $132. the person you're responding to is nuts - no one that commutes from Bronx to downtown is paying per swipe.
- precommunicator 2y ago
  So assuming two rides in each working day that's still $6.42 per day
  - ceejayoz 2y ago
    Assuming you don't take any non-work rides, ever.
  - evanelias 2y ago
    That's a bad assumption, since NYC residents tend to use the subway for non-work-related travel as well.
  - almostgotcaught 2y ago
    As mentioned, you hop on a train to do anything/everything. In a single weekend you might take 10 rides. Edit: well if you live in a part of the city that has good coverage - up in the Bronx it's not so great naturally so I wouldn't be surprised if those people didn't get as much value out of a monthly card.
    - bobthepanda 2y ago
      But those people can still use local buses to get around on the exact same pass. So they could feasibly hit the cap anyways.
      - almostgotcaught 2y ago
        true!
- switch007 2y ago

jeffbee 2y ago

The whole game in 21st-century American governance is selling obvious solutions to unwilling bad-faith deniers. It doesn't really matter that is was obvious all along that congestion pricing was going to work. It doesn't matter that building homes obviously solves homelessness.

jampekka 2y ago
There are many quite obvious alternatives to congestion pricing. E.g. banning (private) vehicles from roads, or having fewer parking spaces or decreasing speed limits. These would also affect people quite equally regardless of how much money they have. With congestion pricing you actually incentivize driving for the wealthy enough.
- jakelazaroff 2y ago
  The same constituencies that oppose congestion pricing also oppose the things you're describing. When the Adams administration effectively ended curbside dining, they were the people telling us that it was an improvement to replace tables for a dozen people with a parking spot for one SUV. The only way we were even able to get congestion pricing passed was by tying it to MTA funding.
  - jampekka 2y ago
    You can oppose congestion pricing but still support restricting driving. Funding MTA more in no way requires congestion pricing. The earmark is mostly a sharade.
    - jakelazaroff 2y ago
      Of course it's possible to hold both of those views. I'm just telling you what happens in practice.
  - 7speter 2y ago
    Have you paid for dining in Manhattan lately? The people who can afford dining in Manhattan and the people who want street parking for their 100k SUV are different sides of the same cohort, generally.