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> Tesla can't even compete in markets with government handouts And China doesn't subsidize their car industry? Chinese EV companies get the real handouts. > T

> Tesla can't even compete in markets with government handouts And China doesn't subsidize their car industry? Chinese EV companies get the real handouts. > Tesla doesn't innovate, they exaggerate All the Chinese EV companies that you can't stop praising literally just copied Tesla's innovations in the EV space bringing them to market in a market viable manner. Looks like attitudes like yours are based on a political axe to grind than on reality.

bigyabai 2y ago
> And China doesn't subsidize their car industry? Chinese EV companies get the real handouts. They do. And Chinese companies deliver the $25,000 EV they promised without bitching to politicians about how hard manufacturing is. > All the Chinese EV companies that you can't stop praising literally just copied Tesla's innovations in the EV space That is how competition works in the free market, yes.
- gibbitz 2y ago
  Pretty sure the Chinese version of a Tesla isn't much worse than the actual thing. The only car I've owned that I liked worse cost $150 dollars in 1991. I don't like Elon Musk, but I hate being ripped off worse.
  - bigyabai 2y ago
    It's hard to do worse. My Uber rides in a Model Y and X have not given me much confidence in Tesla's design chops. Which is a shame, since Starlink works so well and SpaceX seems to manage fine despite their struggles. I'd love to buy an American-made electric vehicle someday, but I'm fine buying ICE until the market gives me alternatives to Tesla. I don't even really hate Musk all that much, I just find it hilarious how people refuse to admit that he lied about FSD and continues to fleece American taxpayers for Tesla's welfare. A fair economy would just let Tesla die already and stop dragging it's corpse up and down Wall Street.
    - ivewonyoung 2y ago
      > continues to fleece American taxpayers for Tesla's welfare Because reduced pollution from clean energy isn't worth anything to "American taxpayers" ? Interestingly, removing EV subsidies will hurt Tesla's competitors more and is likely to help Tesla in the long run.
- ivewonyoung 2y ago
  > And Chinese companies deliver the $25,000 EV they promised without bitching to politicians about how hard manufacturing is Because they get subsidies and use Uyghur slave labor in their supply chain? Not sure how that's something to celebrate. Other car companies complain about costs all the time. Volkswagen and other European companies are really struggling but that's not something someone like you would be aware of since it's not reported in your information bubble. It's all round sad to see. > That is how competition works in the free market, yes So you admit you were wrong when you said Tesla didn't innovate. There is just no point in arguing with people who have no grounding in reality and just parrot talking points.

bigyabai 2y ago

> And China doesn't subsidize their car industry? Chinese EV companies get the real handouts. They do. And Chinese companies deliver the $25,000 EV they promised without bitching to politicians about how hard manufacturing is. > All the Chinese EV companies that you can't stop praising literally just copied Tesla's innovations in the EV space That is how competition works in the free market, yes.

gibbitz 2y ago
Pretty sure the Chinese version of a Tesla isn't much worse than the actual thing. The only car I've owned that I liked worse cost $150 dollars in 1991. I don't like Elon Musk, but I hate being ripped off worse.
- bigyabai 2y ago
  It's hard to do worse. My Uber rides in a Model Y and X have not given me much confidence in Tesla's design chops. Which is a shame, since Starlink works so well and SpaceX seems to manage fine despite their struggles. I'd love to buy an American-made electric vehicle someday, but I'm fine buying ICE until the market gives me alternatives to Tesla. I don't even really hate Musk all that much, I just find it hilarious how people refuse to admit that he lied about FSD and continues to fleece American taxpayers for Tesla's welfare. A fair economy would just let Tesla die already and stop dragging it's corpse up and down Wall Street.
  - ivewonyoung 2y ago
    > continues to fleece American taxpayers for Tesla's welfare Because reduced pollution from clean energy isn't worth anything to "American taxpayers" ? Interestingly, removing EV subsidies will hurt Tesla's competitors more and is likely to help Tesla in the long run.
ivewonyoung 2y ago
> And Chinese companies deliver the $25,000 EV they promised without bitching to politicians about how hard manufacturing is Because they get subsidies and use Uyghur slave labor in their supply chain? Not sure how that's something to celebrate. Other car companies complain about costs all the time. Volkswagen and other European companies are really struggling but that's not something someone like you would be aware of since it's not reported in your information bubble. It's all round sad to see. > That is how competition works in the free market, yes So you admit you were wrong when you said Tesla didn't innovate. There is just no point in arguing with people who have no grounding in reality and just parrot talking points.