5 ms·

I wonder why agents in the field, customs, immigration etc, seem so eager to implement these changes.

by apples_oranges 2y ago

pjc50 2y ago
Rhetorical question, or are you genuinely asking?
- apples_oranges 2y ago
  Genuinely. Are they all Trump fans that say "finally we can do what we always wanted to do" or what? I mean there's the law or some executive order but there's also leeway in implementing. I am not qualified to judge but it just seems to be some sort of preemptive obedience.
  - d3nj4l 2y ago
    > Genuinely. Are they all Trump fans that say "finally we can do what we always wanted to do" or what? Yes. It's trivial to tell if you're not a citizen and go through customs.
  - exe34 2y ago
    I get the impression that a lot of school bullies get into law enforcement. they don't have the skills/credentials to do anything else and they have the streak of cruelty that you need to fit in.
    - MisterTea 2y ago
      I knew a guy in my early 20's, not white, who wanted to be a cop. Once he told me "If I have a bad day, everyone gonna have a bad day." I dont talk to him anymore because he became a cop and turned into a fucking asshole.
      - cratermoon 2y ago
        ACAB
        genewitch 2y ago
        "The bishop's smile, a gilded, hollow thing, hides taxman's greed, and whispers of the king; the knight's sworn oath, a rusted, broken chain, while village elders plot for whispered, selfish gain; no judge's word, nor lord's decree rings true, in thirteen twelve, what's left for us to do?"
        MisterTea 2y ago
        Where is this quoted from?
        cratermoon 2y ago
        1312!
  - blindriver 2y ago
    Obama deported more people than any president in history.
- juujian 2y ago
  I wonder why they chose to work for ICE...
  - toomuchtodo 2y ago
    Position of authority and power.
  - AlecSchueler 2y ago
    Many of them didn't, the right to act as ICE was extended beyond the service itself through executive order.
  - projectazorian 2y ago
    ICE is often the employer of last resort for wannabe cops who can't get jobs at other agencies due to low IQ, poor physical fitness, criminal history, misconduct, etc.
forinti 2y ago
I'm not a psychologist, but I'm pretty sure all police forces should have very strong and active civilian oversight, because they seem to attract (or maybe even nurture) some very aggressive people. In my country, some police forces have skulls on their uniforms and vehicles. How twisted is that?
- rayiner 2y ago
  But the civilian oversight voted for the guy who promised mass deportations.
  - genewitch 2y ago
    Police reform as a platform is career suicide in the US, because the blue lobby is huge. Not as big as AARP or AIPAC but it's up there.
    - gosleepers 2y ago
      [dead]
rjsw 2y ago
They are "Working Towards the Führer" [1]. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ian_Kershaw#%22Working_Towards_the_F%C3%BChrer%22_concept https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ian_Kershaw#%22Working_Towards...
mdp2021 2y ago
Among the first questions: are they well trained? Some countries cut corners over expenses...
- AlecSchueler 2y ago
  In the case of the regular officers who were given ICE powers earlier this year they weren't specifically trained at all.
otikik 2y ago
"Just following orders"
somenameforme 2y ago
You'll find people of Mexican ethnicity widely represented in ICE, Border Patrol, and other such orgs. People looking in from the outside might find this odd, but it's really quite simple. Getting into the US legally is hard, expensive, time consuming, and oh god - the paperwork. And eventually gaining citizenship makes gaining entry look like the easiest thing ever. So you go through all of this, and then somebody else pays some smugglers (enriching some of the worst of humanity), crosses illegally and now 'Yay - Yo soy Americano, hombre!' How do you think the former is going to feel about the latter? It's also not just some American or Mexican thing. The same is true in many expat communities (of Americans) around the world. Actually maintaining your visa and other stuff in many places is frequently a massive PITA, expensive, time consuming, and so on. If somebody's there with the claim 'No you see bro, don't you understand I'm just an "undocumented migrant"', he's going to be held in very poor regard by most people there legally. So even at the most basic level - illegal immigration is deeply unfair to people we want in the country. And that's just one aspect among many. The tales of things gone wrong, or simply of the emotional appeal of somebody trying to make a better life for themselves, can be very appealing - but it's but one dimension of an issue that has affects many, and has many consequences.

I wonder why agents in the field, customs, immigration etc, seem so eager to implement these changes.

pjc50 2y ago

Rhetorical question, or are you genuinely asking?

apples_oranges 2y ago
Genuinely. Are they all Trump fans that say "finally we can do what we always wanted to do" or what? I mean there's the law or some executive order but there's also leeway in implementing. I am not qualified to judge but it just seems to be some sort of preemptive obedience.
- d3nj4l 2y ago
  > Genuinely. Are they all Trump fans that say "finally we can do what we always wanted to do" or what? Yes. It's trivial to tell if you're not a citizen and go through customs.
- exe34 2y ago
  I get the impression that a lot of school bullies get into law enforcement. they don't have the skills/credentials to do anything else and they have the streak of cruelty that you need to fit in.
  - MisterTea 2y ago
    I knew a guy in my early 20's, not white, who wanted to be a cop. Once he told me "If I have a bad day, everyone gonna have a bad day." I dont talk to him anymore because he became a cop and turned into a fucking asshole.
    - cratermoon 2y ago
      ACAB
      - genewitch 2y ago
        "The bishop's smile, a gilded, hollow thing, hides taxman's greed, and whispers of the king; the knight's sworn oath, a rusted, broken chain, while village elders plot for whispered, selfish gain; no judge's word, nor lord's decree rings true, in thirteen twelve, what's left for us to do?"
        MisterTea 2y ago
        Where is this quoted from?
        cratermoon 2y ago
        1312!
- blindriver 2y ago
  Obama deported more people than any president in history.
juujian 2y ago
I wonder why they chose to work for ICE...
- toomuchtodo 2y ago
  Position of authority and power.
- AlecSchueler 2y ago
  Many of them didn't, the right to act as ICE was extended beyond the service itself through executive order.
- projectazorian 2y ago
  ICE is often the employer of last resort for wannabe cops who can't get jobs at other agencies due to low IQ, poor physical fitness, criminal history, misconduct, etc.

forinti 2y ago

I'm not a psychologist, but I'm pretty sure all police forces should have very strong and active civilian oversight, because they seem to attract (or maybe even nurture) some very aggressive people. In my country, some police forces have skulls on their uniforms and vehicles. How twisted is that?

rayiner 2y ago
But the civilian oversight voted for the guy who promised mass deportations.
- genewitch 2y ago
  Police reform as a platform is career suicide in the US, because the blue lobby is huge. Not as big as AARP or AIPAC but it's up there.
  - gosleepers 2y ago
    [dead]

rjsw 2y ago

They are "Working Towards the Führer" [1]. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ian_Kershaw#%22Working_Towards_the_F%C3%BChrer%22_concept https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ian_Kershaw#%22Working_Towards...

mdp2021 2y ago

Among the first questions: are they well trained? Some countries cut corners over expenses...

AlecSchueler 2y ago
In the case of the regular officers who were given ICE powers earlier this year they weren't specifically trained at all.

otikik 2y ago

"Just following orders"

somenameforme 2y ago

You'll find people of Mexican ethnicity widely represented in ICE, Border Patrol, and other such orgs. People looking in from the outside might find this odd, but it's really quite simple. Getting into the US legally is hard, expensive, time consuming, and oh god - the paperwork. And eventually gaining citizenship makes gaining entry look like the easiest thing ever. So you go through all of this, and then somebody else pays some smugglers (enriching some of the worst of humanity), crosses illegally and now 'Yay - Yo soy Americano, hombre!' How do you think the former is going to feel about the latter? It's also not just some American or Mexican thing. The same is true in many expat communities (of Americans) around the world. Actually maintaining your visa and other stuff in many places is frequently a massive PITA, expensive, time consuming, and so on. If somebody's there with the claim 'No you see bro, don't you understand I'm just an "undocumented migrant"', he's going to be held in very poor regard by most people there legally. So even at the most basic level - illegal immigration is deeply unfair to people we want in the country. And that's just one aspect among many. The tales of things gone wrong, or simply of the emotional appeal of somebody trying to make a better life for themselves, can be very appealing - but it's but one dimension of an issue that has affects many, and has many consequences.