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This is horrible and scary, why border guards are even giving the authority to revoke visas is beyond me. When people think about giving cops/guards authority l

This is horrible and scary, why border guards are even giving the authority to revoke visas is beyond me. When people think about giving cops/guards authority like this they need to be picturing the dumbest bully from their grade school. That's who is going to be using the power

pjc50 2y ago
It's Team Grade School Bullies all the way up, from the voters to the representatives. Plus decades of pro-cop propaganda, especially against following the rules.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
blindriver 2y ago
Every country is like this. Israel is the scariest but I remember decades ago crossing into Switzerland by train and in the middle of the night being woken up by border guards with barking German shepherds asking for my passport. I have so many stories it’s funny. On top of the other stories I’ve already posted, my friend who is Canadian drove into Buffalo for dinner and on his way back, they asked him where are you going. He answered “Canada” and they detained him and pulled apart his car looking for drugs. He was detained for hours until they let him go.
- ssijak 2y ago
  "Switzerland by train and in the middle of the night being woken up by border guards with barking German shepherds asking for my passport" What is exactly wrong here? They checked your passport and went on their way, that is how it works.
  - ethbr1 2y ago
    It was hilarious seeing the difference between the French and Swiss border guards on train rides. French: laughing and talking, checking everyone's passports Swiss: eyes scanning the car, papers please
  - blindriver 2y ago
    Nothing wrong. The previous poster claimed that the US Border patrol was excessively scary but my point is this happens everywhere around the world.
    - freehorse 2y ago
      The part OP is scared of and points to is some border guard revoking your visa, which probably implies you losing your job and having to leave the country you live in. This is scary because it is a very big, bad outcome to be totally in the authority of a random border guard to decide. Waking out by guards and dogs barking on a train is scary in its own right the moment it happens, but we are talking about totally different things whose only intersection is "border guards" and the emotional category of "scared".
      - blindriver 2y ago
        [flagged]
        freehorse 2y ago
        I did not say it cannot be revoked or it does not happen anywhere else, I said it is scary for completely different reasons than waking up in a train to a border guard checking your passport. Moreover, both can in principle happen anywhere, but the extent and context of them actually happening also matters.
        snapcaster 2y ago
        It's not nonsense, people are following all the rules and then having some thug with no ability or willingness to understand the situation revoke their visa. This can and will ruin lives I don't see how you're not seeing the problem here
        blindriver 2y ago
        [flagged]
  - dowager_dan99 2y ago
    Why do you need guard dogs to check a passport? Is it the most effective system to do sweep-checks in the middle of the night? Why not check as you're boarding or de-training? What happens if something is wrong or not aligned? Is a stressful situation the best way to conduct routine processes for anybody? HOW shit goes down is really important. When systems reduce people to cogs in a machine they lose empathy and personal responsibility. This is why we end up with guards who know nothing, treat people like cattle, and are "just doing their job". It does not lead to good results.
    - cutemonster 2y ago
      Drug drogs I suspect.
- pjc50 2y ago
  There's a wide spectrum between being aggressive about asking for your passport and detention for weeks. While it's a slippery slope the extent to which it happens, and the extent to which prejudice is involved, varies a lot.
  - blindriver 2y ago
    Are you suggesting that Swiss border patrol would have been more forgiving if I were illegally entering their country?
    - wk_end 2y ago
      Well, she wasn't illegally entering the United States, so that's sort of moot.
      - blindriver 2y ago
        She was. You didn't even do a modicum of research. She co-founded a hemp drink company in California and then self-assigned her own TN visa through the company she founded, which isn't allowed. Her visa was actually illegal and then she was found upon subsequent crossing. She tried to reapply and this time she was detained.
        dowager_dan99 2y ago
        I need to determine if this is true. I had not heard of it before, and the idea she would qualify for a TN visa seemed a little thin, but the rules are so arbitrary and uneven (especially these days) who knows. Regardless this sounds like a nightmare, and to top it off is neither "DOGE-efficient" or increases US security. It's a least 4-combinations of lose-lose.
        blindriver 2y ago
        See my other reply, with receipts: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43413758 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43413758
- nsavage 2y ago
  As a Canadian living near the border (as many Canadians are!), I would often drive into the US for shopping. There are a number of towns that seem dedicated to serving Canadians, like Watertown, NY. I've found that often the US border guards would be much nicer than the Canadian border guards, probably because the Canadians are the ones that need to deal with the customs rules (Canadians aren't trying to smuggle their new purchases back to the US without paying tax!). I haven't been on a shopping trip like that in a while though, and I find it hard to believe I'll ever do it again now. I feel bad for Watertown, but with the tariffs and the risk of detention, its not worth it.
  - dowager_dan99 2y ago
    don't forget a sub-70 cent dollar. Pretty rough to pay that sort of premium and THEN maybe GST and duty on your purchases. It's not the same as a generation ago when you had to go to the US to get their chocolate bars...
  - ilamont 2y ago
    The Walmarts and gas stations near the Northern NY border used to have a lot of Ontario and Quebec plates. I've seen reports that February traffic across the bridges was down ~15% in February YoY.
  - thelittlenag 2y ago
    That's an interesting anecdote. I grew up on a border town, but as a US Citizen often going up into Cananda. Without fail it was always the US border guards who were the jerks (I went to school with their kids!) and the Canadian guards who were gracious and courteous. Given that I've NEVER had what I would call a great interaction with a US border guard, it warms my heart to hear that at least they could be kind to some one ;-)
    - freedomben 2y ago
      This has been my experience as well (as a US citizen). I've crossed the US/Canadian border many times and the US guards are usually the jerks. I always dread re-entry into the US because of that.
- ikerrin1 2y ago
  Canadian here. I recall in 1991 being woken by Swiss border guards in a train carriage full of Germans and Italians. After inspecting their passports they shined the light in my face. They saw my maple leaf on my bag and asked “Est-tu Canadian” bleary eyed I replied “oui” and they said,”it’s fine, we don’t need to see your passport”. Of course 9 years later I was thrown off a train to Czechoslovakia” because they changed the visa requirements at the last minute and my “Let’s Go” guidebook was out of date. Oh being young, stupid and crossing boarders without a clue.
- yerushalayim 2y ago
  Scary can be an effective deterrent against unsavory adversaries.
- seec 2y ago
  Of course, it's kind of the point of having borders and control, if they let anyone in without verifying, it's not even worth having a border. Going from France to UK is like that, and before Shenzen, it was like that from EU country to EU country. When I was young, we had to wait for 2 hours with my parents while they checked everything was in order for a Spain border crossing (we were in a big RV so it makes sense). People on HN have very soft views of the world, being too idealistic libertarian or some sort of socialist derived ideology. Most people may not be criminal but you have to process everyone crossing the border as if because otherwise it's pointless and you will never catch the criminals...
throwawaymaths 2y ago
I'm about to travel to canada on work and as i understand it the last step in the visa is an interview at the port of entry where the border guard can decide if I get to stay or not.
- poulsbohemian 2y ago
  When I went through it years ago, it was mostly about making sure you had all your paperwork in order - had the company sponsoring you provided the relevant information regarding the role and why you were needed, did your resume and experience match at all with the work being performed, etc. Basically I showed up with a list of documents and a very nice border guard looked it over and said welcome to Canada. Each time I traveled up there for work, the border guards were polite and professional. Each time I traveled home, I got pulled aside for advanced screening like I was a drug mule. Just loved all the America trivia questions and deep dives into the history of where I live, just so they could feel good about their jobs.
  - aendruk 2y ago
    > Each time I traveled up there for work, the border guards were polite and professional. Each time I traveled home, I got pulled aside […] Interesting, it was the opposite for me, US citizen with CA work permit circa 2016. CBP seemed to not care while CBSA was often irrationally aggressive and suspicious. The closest thing I got to an explanation once after being freed was “We just like you” with a grin.
    - ethbr1 2y ago
      My experiences with CBSA were pretty bad too. I was grilled in Vancouver about whether the purpose of my visit was work or pleasure, after I helpfully told the officer that my dad was attending a work conference and I was traveling with him but sightseeing. "Well which one is it, work or pleasure?!" I don't know, dude. I just explained the situation: you're supposed to be the expert!
      - 2y ago
bergie 2y ago
The only border experience I've ever had that was worse than US was Canada. And I've traveled quite extensively.

pjc50 2y ago

It's Team Grade School Bullies all the way up, from the voters to the representatives. Plus decades of pro-cop propaganda, especially against following the rules.

deleted 2y ago
[deleted]

blindriver 2y ago

Every country is like this. Israel is the scariest but I remember decades ago crossing into Switzerland by train and in the middle of the night being woken up by border guards with barking German shepherds asking for my passport. I have so many stories it’s funny. On top of the other stories I’ve already posted, my friend who is Canadian drove into Buffalo for dinner and on his way back, they asked him where are you going. He answered “Canada” and they detained him and pulled apart his car looking for drugs. He was detained for hours until they let him go.

ssijak 2y ago
"Switzerland by train and in the middle of the night being woken up by border guards with barking German shepherds asking for my passport" What is exactly wrong here? They checked your passport and went on their way, that is how it works.
- ethbr1 2y ago
  It was hilarious seeing the difference between the French and Swiss border guards on train rides. French: laughing and talking, checking everyone's passports Swiss: eyes scanning the car, papers please
- blindriver 2y ago
  Nothing wrong. The previous poster claimed that the US Border patrol was excessively scary but my point is this happens everywhere around the world.
  - freehorse 2y ago
    The part OP is scared of and points to is some border guard revoking your visa, which probably implies you losing your job and having to leave the country you live in. This is scary because it is a very big, bad outcome to be totally in the authority of a random border guard to decide. Waking out by guards and dogs barking on a train is scary in its own right the moment it happens, but we are talking about totally different things whose only intersection is "border guards" and the emotional category of "scared".
    - blindriver 2y ago
      [flagged]
      - freehorse 2y ago
        I did not say it cannot be revoked or it does not happen anywhere else, I said it is scary for completely different reasons than waking up in a train to a border guard checking your passport. Moreover, both can in principle happen anywhere, but the extent and context of them actually happening also matters.
      - snapcaster 2y ago
        It's not nonsense, people are following all the rules and then having some thug with no ability or willingness to understand the situation revoke their visa. This can and will ruin lives I don't see how you're not seeing the problem here
        blindriver 2y ago
        [flagged]
- dowager_dan99 2y ago
  Why do you need guard dogs to check a passport? Is it the most effective system to do sweep-checks in the middle of the night? Why not check as you're boarding or de-training? What happens if something is wrong or not aligned? Is a stressful situation the best way to conduct routine processes for anybody? HOW shit goes down is really important. When systems reduce people to cogs in a machine they lose empathy and personal responsibility. This is why we end up with guards who know nothing, treat people like cattle, and are "just doing their job". It does not lead to good results.
  - cutemonster 2y ago
    Drug drogs I suspect.
pjc50 2y ago
There's a wide spectrum between being aggressive about asking for your passport and detention for weeks. While it's a slippery slope the extent to which it happens, and the extent to which prejudice is involved, varies a lot.
- blindriver 2y ago
  Are you suggesting that Swiss border patrol would have been more forgiving if I were illegally entering their country?
  - wk_end 2y ago
    Well, she wasn't illegally entering the United States, so that's sort of moot.
    - blindriver 2y ago
      She was. You didn't even do a modicum of research. She co-founded a hemp drink company in California and then self-assigned her own TN visa through the company she founded, which isn't allowed. Her visa was actually illegal and then she was found upon subsequent crossing. She tried to reapply and this time she was detained.
      - dowager_dan99 2y ago
        I need to determine if this is true. I had not heard of it before, and the idea she would qualify for a TN visa seemed a little thin, but the rules are so arbitrary and uneven (especially these days) who knows. Regardless this sounds like a nightmare, and to top it off is neither "DOGE-efficient" or increases US security. It's a least 4-combinations of lose-lose.
        blindriver 2y ago
        See my other reply, with receipts: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43413758 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43413758
nsavage 2y ago
As a Canadian living near the border (as many Canadians are!), I would often drive into the US for shopping. There are a number of towns that seem dedicated to serving Canadians, like Watertown, NY. I've found that often the US border guards would be much nicer than the Canadian border guards, probably because the Canadians are the ones that need to deal with the customs rules (Canadians aren't trying to smuggle their new purchases back to the US without paying tax!). I haven't been on a shopping trip like that in a while though, and I find it hard to believe I'll ever do it again now. I feel bad for Watertown, but with the tariffs and the risk of detention, its not worth it.
- dowager_dan99 2y ago
  don't forget a sub-70 cent dollar. Pretty rough to pay that sort of premium and THEN maybe GST and duty on your purchases. It's not the same as a generation ago when you had to go to the US to get their chocolate bars...
- ilamont 2y ago
  The Walmarts and gas stations near the Northern NY border used to have a lot of Ontario and Quebec plates. I've seen reports that February traffic across the bridges was down ~15% in February YoY.
- thelittlenag 2y ago
  That's an interesting anecdote. I grew up on a border town, but as a US Citizen often going up into Cananda. Without fail it was always the US border guards who were the jerks (I went to school with their kids!) and the Canadian guards who were gracious and courteous. Given that I've NEVER had what I would call a great interaction with a US border guard, it warms my heart to hear that at least they could be kind to some one ;-)
  - freedomben 2y ago
    This has been my experience as well (as a US citizen). I've crossed the US/Canadian border many times and the US guards are usually the jerks. I always dread re-entry into the US because of that.
ikerrin1 2y ago
Canadian here. I recall in 1991 being woken by Swiss border guards in a train carriage full of Germans and Italians. After inspecting their passports they shined the light in my face. They saw my maple leaf on my bag and asked “Est-tu Canadian” bleary eyed I replied “oui” and they said,”it’s fine, we don’t need to see your passport”. Of course 9 years later I was thrown off a train to Czechoslovakia” because they changed the visa requirements at the last minute and my “Let’s Go” guidebook was out of date. Oh being young, stupid and crossing boarders without a clue.
yerushalayim 2y ago
Scary can be an effective deterrent against unsavory adversaries.
seec 2y ago
Of course, it's kind of the point of having borders and control, if they let anyone in without verifying, it's not even worth having a border. Going from France to UK is like that, and before Shenzen, it was like that from EU country to EU country. When I was young, we had to wait for 2 hours with my parents while they checked everything was in order for a Spain border crossing (we were in a big RV so it makes sense). People on HN have very soft views of the world, being too idealistic libertarian or some sort of socialist derived ideology. Most people may not be criminal but you have to process everyone crossing the border as if because otherwise it's pointless and you will never catch the criminals...

throwawaymaths 2y ago

I'm about to travel to canada on work and as i understand it the last step in the visa is an interview at the port of entry where the border guard can decide if I get to stay or not.

poulsbohemian 2y ago
When I went through it years ago, it was mostly about making sure you had all your paperwork in order - had the company sponsoring you provided the relevant information regarding the role and why you were needed, did your resume and experience match at all with the work being performed, etc. Basically I showed up with a list of documents and a very nice border guard looked it over and said welcome to Canada. Each time I traveled up there for work, the border guards were polite and professional. Each time I traveled home, I got pulled aside for advanced screening like I was a drug mule. Just loved all the America trivia questions and deep dives into the history of where I live, just so they could feel good about their jobs.
- aendruk 2y ago
  > Each time I traveled up there for work, the border guards were polite and professional. Each time I traveled home, I got pulled aside […] Interesting, it was the opposite for me, US citizen with CA work permit circa 2016. CBP seemed to not care while CBSA was often irrationally aggressive and suspicious. The closest thing I got to an explanation once after being freed was “We just like you” with a grin.
  - ethbr1 2y ago
    My experiences with CBSA were pretty bad too. I was grilled in Vancouver about whether the purpose of my visit was work or pleasure, after I helpfully told the officer that my dad was attending a work conference and I was traveling with him but sightseeing. "Well which one is it, work or pleasure?!" I don't know, dude. I just explained the situation: you're supposed to be the expert!
    - 2y ago

bergie 2y ago

The only border experience I've ever had that was worse than US was Canada. And I've traveled quite extensively.