6 ms·

The really interesting news here is that in Turkey you need a degree to run for president.

wnevets 2y ago
I'm sure it sounded like a good idea at the time but this proves once again these kind of limitations placed on leadership positions can and will be exploited.
- jayknight 2y ago
  In 2028, The State of Indiana is going to issue a corrected birth certificate for Pete Buttigieg showing him to be 32 years and therefore not eligible to be president.
  - JumpCrisscross 2y ago
    The Constitution requires Presidents “have attained to the Age of thirty five Years” [1]. It cites the fact, not the certificate. The Turkish law doesn’t seem to require an education, it requires a degree. Minor difference. (And the text of the law wouldn’t matter in the end.) But an interesting difference nevertheless. [1] https://constitution.congress.gov/constitution/article-2/ https://constitution.congress.gov/constitution/article-2/
    - YZF 2y ago
      Can't this be fixed easily by another university bestowing an honorary degree to this guy then?
      - JumpCrisscross 2y ago
        > Can't this be fixed easily by another university bestowing an honorary degree to this guy then? No. That’s a technical solution to a political problem. But, we’re on HN! Does anyone have a good English translation of the relevant statute? The loopholes to a certificate problem are with the certification authority—how is a compliant degree defined?
        wodenokoto 2y ago
        Cancelling his degree is just as technical a solution to a political problem.
        hoseja 2y ago
        Sure but Erdogan can just have him cut up for kebab if he doesn't take the hint. Not so the other way around.
        JumpCrisscross 2y ago
        > Cancelling his degree is just as technical a solution to a political problem Violating a law versus violating a norm. Big difference.
  - klipt 2y ago
    Or claim he wasn't even born the US...
  - echelon 2y ago
    I'm LGBT and I feel fairly confident in saying that there's no way in hell America will elect a gay man in my lifetime. If Pete is the Democratic candidate, it's a freebie to the Republicans. I think that Democrats that believe a Pete win is possible live in a bubble. Their views are invalid until they travel the States more to increase their exposure to the rest of the electorate.
    - almostgotcaught 2y ago
      > gay man i think you're wrong and i certainly don't live in a bubble. but the reason i think you're wrong is not that america is progressive enough accept a gay man but because he's basically not gay; he's absolutely the least gay presenting man in the history of gay presenting men (exaggerating a little). he has no lisp, not an ounce of flamboyancy, nothing, zilch, nada. I'm aware he's fully out and there are photos of him with his husband and child and etc. he's also young, handsome, ivy-league educated, was an officer in the military and deployed, intelligent, extremely well-spoken, and charismatic (not to mention experienced but who cares about such trivial things). he has all of the qualities that made obama successful in 2008 just swap black->gay. most importantly, and i'm not flaunting this: he's a man. so i do hope he runs because he i think he has a better chance than bernie or kamala or walz or newsom or hakeem or aoc. but hey we all know there won't be an election in 2028 anyway so what are we even talking about here lol.
      - tsimionescu 2y ago
        I wonder if he'd "dedicate another apse in his cathedral mind" [0] to trying to find out. The amount and shamelessness of sycophancy that modern American politicians cultivate is staggering (Trump being the chief example, of course - but seeing this with someone as relatively obscure as Pete is also spectacular). [0] https://www.wired.com/story/pete-buttigieg-interview-god-beer-electric-mustang/ https://www.wired.com/story/pete-buttigieg-interview-god-bee...
      - kelnos 2y ago
        I really don't think any of that matters. "He can pass for straight" is not going to sway much of anyone who is uncomfortable with the idea of a gay president. Sure, some voters would be more comfortable with Buttigieg than with, say, a flamboyantly gay man, but overall I don't see the electorate going for him.
- wavemode 2y ago
  Very commonly seen in corporate politics. A promotion has certain requirements which seem objective, but all someone has to do to block your promotion is simply make sure you never get assigned any work which would fulfill the requirements.
decimalenough 2y ago
Wait until you see what the requirements are to run for president in Singapore: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Presidential_elections_in_Singapore#Strictness_of_qualifications https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Presidential_elections_in_Sing... Mysteriously, the requirements are tightened up and/or new ones are invented every time a credible-looking opposition candidate pops up. Most famously, before the 2017 election the requirement was imposed that the president has to be selected from a rotating selection of races, in this case Malay, which by complete coincidence disqualified the otherwise-qualified Chinese opposition candidate: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017_Singaporean_presidential_election https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017_Singaporean_presidential_...
cadamsdotcom 2y ago
Turkish law experts: say some other university grants an honorary degree in response to this. Would that make him compliant again to run for office?
- vkou 2y ago
  IANAL, but you generally can't rules lawyer your way out of an autocracy.
- johnthewise 2y ago
  well, if you can arbitrarily nullify degrees, you can also decide the new degree is not valid.
breadwinner 2y ago
United States from the 1890s to the 1960s required voters to pass a literacy before they could vote. We should bring back this rule. Voters should have a minimum level of knowledge about the world, science and democracy in order to vote. This would have prevented the current disaster which threatens not just our democracy, but by denying climate change, the entire planet.
- DC-3 2y ago
  I'm not even American and yet where I'm from it's common knowledge that literacy tests were used to systematically disenfranchise black people from voting.
  - breadwinner 2y ago
    Right, and that was apparently constitutional. If so we can bring back the law, but this time to disenfranchise dumb voters.
    - lazyasciiart 2y ago
      No, it wasn't. https://www.annenbergclassroom.org/timeline_event/literacy-tests-are-ruled-unconstitutional/ https://www.annenbergclassroom.org/timeline_event/literacy-t...
      - breadwinner 2y ago
        As you see in the article you linked, it was ruled unconstitutional only because it violated the 15th amendment. That amendment makes it illegal to deny the right to vote based on race, color, or previous condition of servitude. It is still legal to deny the right to vote if someone is deemed not smart enough.
        crooked-v 2y ago
        The literacy tests in question were designed from the start to be ambiguous, so that the same answers could be marked wrong for a black person and correct for a white person. Frankly, there is nothing that could convince me that the Republicans wouldn't try to repeat the same thing if given the opportunity.

I'm sure it sounded like a good idea at the time but this proves once again these kind of limitations placed on leadership positions can and will be exploited.

jayknight 2y ago
In 2028, The State of Indiana is going to issue a corrected birth certificate for Pete Buttigieg showing him to be 32 years and therefore not eligible to be president.
- JumpCrisscross 2y ago
  The Constitution requires Presidents “have attained to the Age of thirty five Years” [1]. It cites the fact, not the certificate. The Turkish law doesn’t seem to require an education, it requires a degree. Minor difference. (And the text of the law wouldn’t matter in the end.) But an interesting difference nevertheless. [1] https://constitution.congress.gov/constitution/article-2/ https://constitution.congress.gov/constitution/article-2/
  - YZF 2y ago
    Can't this be fixed easily by another university bestowing an honorary degree to this guy then?
    - JumpCrisscross 2y ago
      > Can't this be fixed easily by another university bestowing an honorary degree to this guy then? No. That’s a technical solution to a political problem. But, we’re on HN! Does anyone have a good English translation of the relevant statute? The loopholes to a certificate problem are with the certification authority—how is a compliant degree defined?
      - wodenokoto 2y ago
        Cancelling his degree is just as technical a solution to a political problem.
        hoseja 2y ago
        Sure but Erdogan can just have him cut up for kebab if he doesn't take the hint. Not so the other way around.
        JumpCrisscross 2y ago
        > Cancelling his degree is just as technical a solution to a political problem Violating a law versus violating a norm. Big difference.
- klipt 2y ago
  Or claim he wasn't even born the US...
- echelon 2y ago
  I'm LGBT and I feel fairly confident in saying that there's no way in hell America will elect a gay man in my lifetime. If Pete is the Democratic candidate, it's a freebie to the Republicans. I think that Democrats that believe a Pete win is possible live in a bubble. Their views are invalid until they travel the States more to increase their exposure to the rest of the electorate.
  - almostgotcaught 2y ago
    > gay man i think you're wrong and i certainly don't live in a bubble. but the reason i think you're wrong is not that america is progressive enough accept a gay man but because he's basically not gay; he's absolutely the least gay presenting man in the history of gay presenting men (exaggerating a little). he has no lisp, not an ounce of flamboyancy, nothing, zilch, nada. I'm aware he's fully out and there are photos of him with his husband and child and etc. he's also young, handsome, ivy-league educated, was an officer in the military and deployed, intelligent, extremely well-spoken, and charismatic (not to mention experienced but who cares about such trivial things). he has all of the qualities that made obama successful in 2008 just swap black->gay. most importantly, and i'm not flaunting this: he's a man. so i do hope he runs because he i think he has a better chance than bernie or kamala or walz or newsom or hakeem or aoc. but hey we all know there won't be an election in 2028 anyway so what are we even talking about here lol.
    - tsimionescu 2y ago
      I wonder if he'd "dedicate another apse in his cathedral mind" [0] to trying to find out. The amount and shamelessness of sycophancy that modern American politicians cultivate is staggering (Trump being the chief example, of course - but seeing this with someone as relatively obscure as Pete is also spectacular). [0] https://www.wired.com/story/pete-buttigieg-interview-god-beer-electric-mustang/ https://www.wired.com/story/pete-buttigieg-interview-god-bee...
    - kelnos 2y ago
      I really don't think any of that matters. "He can pass for straight" is not going to sway much of anyone who is uncomfortable with the idea of a gay president. Sure, some voters would be more comfortable with Buttigieg than with, say, a flamboyantly gay man, but overall I don't see the electorate going for him.
wavemode 2y ago
Very commonly seen in corporate politics. A promotion has certain requirements which seem objective, but all someone has to do to block your promotion is simply make sure you never get assigned any work which would fulfill the requirements.

decimalenough 2y ago

Wait until you see what the requirements are to run for president in Singapore: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Presidential_elections_in_Singapore#Strictness_of_qualifications https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Presidential_elections_in_Sing... Mysteriously, the requirements are tightened up and/or new ones are invented every time a credible-looking opposition candidate pops up. Most famously, before the 2017 election the requirement was imposed that the president has to be selected from a rotating selection of races, in this case Malay, which by complete coincidence disqualified the otherwise-qualified Chinese opposition candidate: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017_Singaporean_presidential_election https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2017_Singaporean_presidential_...

cadamsdotcom 2y ago

Turkish law experts: say some other university grants an honorary degree in response to this. Would that make him compliant again to run for office?

vkou 2y ago
IANAL, but you generally can't rules lawyer your way out of an autocracy.
johnthewise 2y ago
well, if you can arbitrarily nullify degrees, you can also decide the new degree is not valid.

breadwinner 2y ago

United States from the 1890s to the 1960s required voters to pass a literacy before they could vote. We should bring back this rule. Voters should have a minimum level of knowledge about the world, science and democracy in order to vote. This would have prevented the current disaster which threatens not just our democracy, but by denying climate change, the entire planet.

DC-3 2y ago
I'm not even American and yet where I'm from it's common knowledge that literacy tests were used to systematically disenfranchise black people from voting.
- breadwinner 2y ago
  Right, and that was apparently constitutional. If so we can bring back the law, but this time to disenfranchise dumb voters.
  - lazyasciiart 2y ago
    No, it wasn't. https://www.annenbergclassroom.org/timeline_event/literacy-tests-are-ruled-unconstitutional/ https://www.annenbergclassroom.org/timeline_event/literacy-t...
    - breadwinner 2y ago
      As you see in the article you linked, it was ruled unconstitutional only because it violated the 15th amendment. That amendment makes it illegal to deny the right to vote based on race, color, or previous condition of servitude. It is still legal to deny the right to vote if someone is deemed not smart enough.
      - crooked-v 2y ago
        The literacy tests in question were designed from the start to be ambiguous, so that the same answers could be marked wrong for a black person and correct for a white person. Frankly, there is nothing that could convince me that the Republicans wouldn't try to repeat the same thing if given the opportunity.