3 ms·

How the h*ll was cashless supposed to be a utopia, anyway? Were people fantasizing that "cashless" somehow meant a post-scarcity society, where everyone had in

How the h*ll was cashless supposed to be a utopia, anyway? Were people fantasizing that "cashless" somehow meant a post-scarcity society, where everyone had infinite money? And was big business quietly pushing the idea, figuring that "cashless" would help them rake a percentage off every transaction, while encouraging even more people to overspend and go into debt?

emptyfile 2y ago
[dead]
tonyedgecombe 2y ago
>How the hell was cashless supposed to be a utopia, anyway? It wasn't, that was just journalistic flourish. It was (and is) a convenience and a barrier to crime. >And was big business quietly pushing the idea Business wasn't quietly pushing the idea, they have been shouting from the rooftops. >figuring that "cashless" would help them rake a percentage off every transaction Interestingly my local cafe pays lower fees on card transactions than they do on cash deposits into the bank.
- bell-cot 2y ago
  > ...and a barrier to crime... A decent barrier to street crime - which, yes, does push emotional buttons. But now-obviously at the expense of facilitating non-street crime, and "non-profit" attacks on computerized infrastructure. > ...my local cafe pays... Might I ask your nation? Here (USA, SE Michigan) quite a few businesses advertise discounts (often ~3%) for paying with cash - because of the fees raked off by the card companies.
  - pxx 2y ago
    Cash logistics typically cost much more than credit card fees no matter where you are located [0]. In the US, explicit cash deposit fees are typically only at ~0.1-0.3% (as a consumer you don't see these but check out a business fee schedule), but there's a lot more that goes into cash logistics, including transport, the risk of counterfeiting, internal and external theft, etc. Cash discounts in the US are mostly a way to encourage the customer to collude in tax evasion. It's not an actual comparison of costs. [0] see e.g. https://sbecouncil.org/2024/07/01/the-cost-of-cash/ https://sbecouncil.org/2024/07/01/the-cost-of-cash/ for a US based analysis. this is even before you consider increased spend when people use cards.
  - tonyedgecombe 2y ago
    >But now-obviously at the expense of facilitating non-street crime, and "non-profit" attacks on computerized infrastructure. I was thinking more about internal crime (people dipping into the till) and tax evasion.
  - johnisgood 2y ago
    Here in Hungary sometimes online stores charge you extra if you want to pay with cash.
Yeul 2y ago
I don't know about utopia but I leave the house with just my smartphone. And transactions costs for cash are higher than using a card or smartphone- this is what pushed banks to push for plastic in the first place. The reality is that we are at a point were most people use cash only for criminal transactions or evading the tax man. Including myself- I pay the cleaning lady in cash because of her immigration status.
Gud 2y ago
FWIW I am as paranoid as they come, but paying using cash is absolutely less convenient than using Apple Pay.
deleted 2y ago
[deleted]

emptyfile 2y ago

[dead]

tonyedgecombe 2y ago

>How the hell was cashless supposed to be a utopia, anyway? It wasn't, that was just journalistic flourish. It was (and is) a convenience and a barrier to crime. >And was big business quietly pushing the idea Business wasn't quietly pushing the idea, they have been shouting from the rooftops. >figuring that "cashless" would help them rake a percentage off every transaction Interestingly my local cafe pays lower fees on card transactions than they do on cash deposits into the bank.

bell-cot 2y ago
> ...and a barrier to crime... A decent barrier to street crime - which, yes, does push emotional buttons. But now-obviously at the expense of facilitating non-street crime, and "non-profit" attacks on computerized infrastructure. > ...my local cafe pays... Might I ask your nation? Here (USA, SE Michigan) quite a few businesses advertise discounts (often ~3%) for paying with cash - because of the fees raked off by the card companies.
- pxx 2y ago
  Cash logistics typically cost much more than credit card fees no matter where you are located [0]. In the US, explicit cash deposit fees are typically only at ~0.1-0.3% (as a consumer you don't see these but check out a business fee schedule), but there's a lot more that goes into cash logistics, including transport, the risk of counterfeiting, internal and external theft, etc. Cash discounts in the US are mostly a way to encourage the customer to collude in tax evasion. It's not an actual comparison of costs. [0] see e.g. https://sbecouncil.org/2024/07/01/the-cost-of-cash/ https://sbecouncil.org/2024/07/01/the-cost-of-cash/ for a US based analysis. this is even before you consider increased spend when people use cards.
- tonyedgecombe 2y ago
  >But now-obviously at the expense of facilitating non-street crime, and "non-profit" attacks on computerized infrastructure. I was thinking more about internal crime (people dipping into the till) and tax evasion.
- johnisgood 2y ago
  Here in Hungary sometimes online stores charge you extra if you want to pay with cash.

Yeul 2y ago

I don't know about utopia but I leave the house with just my smartphone. And transactions costs for cash are higher than using a card or smartphone- this is what pushed banks to push for plastic in the first place. The reality is that we are at a point were most people use cash only for criminal transactions or evading the tax man. Including myself- I pay the cleaning lady in cash because of her immigration status.

Gud 2y ago

FWIW I am as paranoid as they come, but paying using cash is absolutely less convenient than using Apple Pay.

deleted 2y ago

[deleted]