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Dislike the current Trump administration as you might, this is a very far cry than the european brand of radical right from the thirties, which was preoccupied

by breppp 2y ago

Dislike the current Trump administration as you might, this is a very far cry than the european brand of radical right from the thirties, which was preoccupied with human sacrifice

watwut 2y ago
It is not thirties. These people Sieg Heil and literally fund radical right in Europe. Also they already attempted violent couples once. And have zero respect for law while having unchecked power.
- blackeyeblitzar 2y ago
  Is it the radical right or the radical left that doesn’t respect law and uses violence for political reasons? BLM, antisemitic occupations of campuses, and now terrorism against Tesla owners, are all from the left. Even if there were comparable examples from the right, surely in the least you can admit that violence isn’t exclusive to the right.
  - watwut 2y ago
    I did not said it is exclusive to the right. I said right attempted violent coup. Also, in USA, right wing terrorism/violence is the most common one. Protests itself are legal and fine. As much as you hate pushing for rights of non-whites or palestinians or women, none of it counts as "violent coup". Likewise, calling vandalism against Teslas "terrorism" is a stretch.
    - blackeyeblitzar 2y ago
      [flagged]
      - ako 2y ago
        It’s sad to see how these discussions always seem to be a fight to win the discussion with arguments. We need to try harder to understand each other, otherwise this will only polarize further, and end with real fighting. It’s sad that everyone sees the world differently, through different media, and we can’t agree on what is happening. Repeating what you’ve seen will never convince someone that has seen different things…
        blackeyeblitzar 2y ago
        Thanks. I’ll admit I am guilty of this. But I don’t know what the solution is. Features like flagging and voting tend to create hostility in these discussions, and I think that’s part of the problem. But another problem is the atmosphere created by constant attack pieces in news and social media, which leaves everyone in a really emotional state. If you have solutions, though please do share!
        kennyloginz 2y ago
        I say this from a caring perspective, but from your comments, I would suggest avoiding social media and Fox News for a year… “ BLM, antisemitic occupations of campuses, and now terrorism against Tesla owners”
LadyCailin 2y ago
While you’re certainly right that the US isn’t like Germany in 1941, I don’t think there’s any reason to believe it can’t very quickly get to that point. Just ask the asylum seekers and other immigrants and tourists[1][2] (illegal or otherwise) that have been separated from their children[3], detained in extrajudicial facilities[4], kept in solitary confinement[1], or legal immigrants stripped of their permanent residency and deported for exercising their first amendment rights[5]. This is very equivalent to how it started in Germany as early as 1933[6]. I see no reason the US can’t VERY quickly slide down this path with immigrants (of any sort), trans people, and then after that, much more. Especially when so much has been done to destroy any oversight that the checks and balances of the government would have provided, i.e. two failed impeachments, (and congress now being filled with Trump bootlickers, unlikely to impeach again), entirely too broad presidential immunity rulings[7], and completely unpunished coup attempts[8]. [1] https://www.nytimes.com/2025/03/13/world/europe/german-tourists-detained-deported.html https://www.nytimes.com/2025/03/13/world/europe/german-touri... [2] https://www.huffpost.com/entry/british-tourist-detained-ice_n_67d07d8fe4b02a1e69bd8f19 https://www.huffpost.com/entry/british-tourist-detained-ice_... [3] https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-44303556 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-44303556 [4] https://apnews.com/article/us-immigration-detention-guantanamo-bay-d4fe8f0d051e0cd7e3f04ce02c8e7564 https://apnews.com/article/us-immigration-detention-guantana... [5] https://edition.cnn.com/2025/03/11/us/mahmoud-khalil-columbia-ice-green-card-hnk/index.html https://edition.cnn.com/2025/03/11/us/mahmoud-khalil-columbi... [6] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Holocaust_in_Germany https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Holocaust_in_Germany [7] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trump_v._United_States_(2024) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trump_v._United_States_(2024... [8] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pardon_of_January_6_United_States_Capitol_attack_defendants https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pardon_of_January_6_United_S...
- breppp 2y ago
  I understand the feeling of alarmism as US politics right now look like a zero sum game with no possibility of compromise from either side But as a descendent of Nazi slaves whose entire families were murdered, I fail to see the similarities between a movement that had established concentration camps and declared its intention of genocide from day one, and the present day rule of idiots that is the United States I think the fact that comparisons are thrown too easily to the point of cliche only make up for this sense of historical determinism that often makes things worse
goosedragons 2y ago
In the thirties? The Trump admin has already begun targeting trans people and immigrants. No, they're not building death camps and using firing squads but that didn't happen in Nazi Germany in the thirties either. Remember the allies in WWII weren't really aware the Germans were commiting mass genocide until after the war.
- nomdep 2y ago
  ILLEGAL immigrants. Using them and transgender people in the same talking point seems like an intentional attempt to conflate unrelated issues
  - goosedragons 2y ago
    Yeah? Just illegal immigrants? They haven't detained anybody on a green card lately? https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/mar/14/why-was-mahmoud-khalil-arrested https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/mar/14/why-was-mahm...
    - nomdep 2y ago
      The guy who broke several of the conditions to keep his green card? Yeah, sure. Why following the law bothers you so much?
      - goosedragons 2y ago
        Yeah? Protesting? What conditions?
        immibis 2y ago
        Apparently the first amendment doesn't apply to permanent residents.

by breppp 2y ago

Dislike the current Trump administration as you might, this is a very far cry than the european brand of radical right from the thirties, which was preoccupied with human sacrifice

watwut 2y ago

It is not thirties. These people Sieg Heil and literally fund radical right in Europe. Also they already attempted violent couples once. And have zero respect for law while having unchecked power.

blackeyeblitzar 2y ago
Is it the radical right or the radical left that doesn’t respect law and uses violence for political reasons? BLM, antisemitic occupations of campuses, and now terrorism against Tesla owners, are all from the left. Even if there were comparable examples from the right, surely in the least you can admit that violence isn’t exclusive to the right.
- watwut 2y ago
  I did not said it is exclusive to the right. I said right attempted violent coup. Also, in USA, right wing terrorism/violence is the most common one. Protests itself are legal and fine. As much as you hate pushing for rights of non-whites or palestinians or women, none of it counts as "violent coup". Likewise, calling vandalism against Teslas "terrorism" is a stretch.
  - blackeyeblitzar 2y ago
    [flagged]
    - ako 2y ago
      It’s sad to see how these discussions always seem to be a fight to win the discussion with arguments. We need to try harder to understand each other, otherwise this will only polarize further, and end with real fighting. It’s sad that everyone sees the world differently, through different media, and we can’t agree on what is happening. Repeating what you’ve seen will never convince someone that has seen different things…
      - blackeyeblitzar 2y ago
        Thanks. I’ll admit I am guilty of this. But I don’t know what the solution is. Features like flagging and voting tend to create hostility in these discussions, and I think that’s part of the problem. But another problem is the atmosphere created by constant attack pieces in news and social media, which leaves everyone in a really emotional state. If you have solutions, though please do share!
        kennyloginz 2y ago
        I say this from a caring perspective, but from your comments, I would suggest avoiding social media and Fox News for a year… “ BLM, antisemitic occupations of campuses, and now terrorism against Tesla owners”

LadyCailin 2y ago

While you’re certainly right that the US isn’t like Germany in 1941, I don’t think there’s any reason to believe it can’t very quickly get to that point. Just ask the asylum seekers and other immigrants and tourists[1][2] (illegal or otherwise) that have been separated from their children[3], detained in extrajudicial facilities[4], kept in solitary confinement[1], or legal immigrants stripped of their permanent residency and deported for exercising their first amendment rights[5]. This is very equivalent to how it started in Germany as early as 1933[6]. I see no reason the US can’t VERY quickly slide down this path with immigrants (of any sort), trans people, and then after that, much more. Especially when so much has been done to destroy any oversight that the checks and balances of the government would have provided, i.e. two failed impeachments, (and congress now being filled with Trump bootlickers, unlikely to impeach again), entirely too broad presidential immunity rulings[7], and completely unpunished coup attempts[8]. [1] https://www.nytimes.com/2025/03/13/world/europe/german-tourists-detained-deported.html https://www.nytimes.com/2025/03/13/world/europe/german-touri... [2] https://www.huffpost.com/entry/british-tourist-detained-ice_n_67d07d8fe4b02a1e69bd8f19 https://www.huffpost.com/entry/british-tourist-detained-ice_... [3] https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-44303556 https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-44303556 [4] https://apnews.com/article/us-immigration-detention-guantanamo-bay-d4fe8f0d051e0cd7e3f04ce02c8e7564 https://apnews.com/article/us-immigration-detention-guantana... [5] https://edition.cnn.com/2025/03/11/us/mahmoud-khalil-columbia-ice-green-card-hnk/index.html https://edition.cnn.com/2025/03/11/us/mahmoud-khalil-columbi... [6] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Holocaust_in_Germany https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Holocaust_in_Germany [7] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trump_v._United_States_(2024) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trump_v._United_States_(2024... [8] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pardon_of_January_6_United_States_Capitol_attack_defendants https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pardon_of_January_6_United_S...

breppp 2y ago
I understand the feeling of alarmism as US politics right now look like a zero sum game with no possibility of compromise from either side But as a descendent of Nazi slaves whose entire families were murdered, I fail to see the similarities between a movement that had established concentration camps and declared its intention of genocide from day one, and the present day rule of idiots that is the United States I think the fact that comparisons are thrown too easily to the point of cliche only make up for this sense of historical determinism that often makes things worse

goosedragons 2y ago

In the thirties? The Trump admin has already begun targeting trans people and immigrants. No, they're not building death camps and using firing squads but that didn't happen in Nazi Germany in the thirties either. Remember the allies in WWII weren't really aware the Germans were commiting mass genocide until after the war.

nomdep 2y ago
ILLEGAL immigrants. Using them and transgender people in the same talking point seems like an intentional attempt to conflate unrelated issues
- goosedragons 2y ago
  Yeah? Just illegal immigrants? They haven't detained anybody on a green card lately? https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/mar/14/why-was-mahmoud-khalil-arrested https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2025/mar/14/why-was-mahm...
  - nomdep 2y ago
    The guy who broke several of the conditions to keep his green card? Yeah, sure. Why following the law bothers you so much?
    - goosedragons 2y ago
      Yeah? Protesting? What conditions?
      - immibis 2y ago
        Apparently the first amendment doesn't apply to permanent residents.