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It probably needs to be a law not an executive order but I don't hate the idea. States have the power to make it prohibitively expensive to operate in those st

It probably needs to be a law not an executive order but I don't hate the idea. States have the power to make it prohibitively expensive to operate in those states, leaving people to either go to VPNs or use AI's hosted in other countries where they don't care if they're not following whatever new AI law California decides to pass. And companies would choose just to use datacenters not in the prohibitive states and ban ips from those states. Course if a company hosts in us-east-1, and allows access from California, would the inter state commerce clause not take effect and California would have no power anyways?

pjc50 2y ago
> leaving people to either go to VPNs .. which is the prevailing situation for people dealing with state-by-state age verification at the moment.
arrosenberg 2y ago
> Course if a company hosts in us-east-1, and allows access from California, would the inter state commerce clause not take effect and California would have no power anyways? California can't legislate how they serve a customer in a different state. They would have to comply when serving California customers within the state of California, regardless of where the dc is located. I.E. Under the CCPA it doesn't matter where my data is stored, they still have to delete it upon my request.
- ApolloFortyNine 2y ago
  >California can't legislate how they serve a customer in a different state. They would have to comply when serving California customers within the state of California, regardless of where the dc is located. I.E. Under the CCPA it doesn't matter where my data is stored, they still have to delete it upon my request. I know this is what California thinks, I just personally don't see how this isn't inter state commerce.
  - TheCoelacanth 2y ago
    It is, of course, but that doesn't mean California can't regulate it; simply that federal laws take precedence. If states couldn't regulate interstate commerce taking place in their own states, they effectively couldn't regulate any commerce because court decisions have found that essentially all economic activity, even growing food for your own consumption, falls under the banner of interstate commerce.
    - dynm 2y ago
      > even growing food for your own consumption Hey I know this one! In case anyone is interested, here's the case: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wickard_v._Filburn https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wickard_v._Filburn
  - arrosenberg 2y ago
    Unless their a superseding federal law, yeah, California can successfully prosecute businesses for breaking the laws within its' jurisdiction.
int_19h 2y ago
Interstate commerce clause by itself doesn't prevent it; it merely gives Congress the ability to override the state laws if Congress deems it necessary.
tmpz22 2y ago
Are you advocating to take the power relegated to the states away from the states and give it to the federal government in direct violation of the Constitution of the United States?
- hiatus 2y ago
  How is this not directly tied to interstate commerce (and copyright law) and thus under Congress' enumerated powers?
- ApolloFortyNine 2y ago
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commerce_Clause https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commerce_Clause
armchairhacker 2y ago
Your argument for regulation is...reasons why it works out without regulation, and is already covered by existing regulations? Granted the "regulation" I'm referring to above is a law or EO to block California's regulation, and I don't support California's regulation either. But I believe regulations should only exist when there's no better alternative, because they usually have unintended consequences. If it's true that OpenAI can basically just leave California, the better alternative for the government may be doing nothing.

pjc50 2y ago

> leaving people to either go to VPNs .. which is the prevailing situation for people dealing with state-by-state age verification at the moment.

arrosenberg 2y ago

> Course if a company hosts in us-east-1, and allows access from California, would the inter state commerce clause not take effect and California would have no power anyways? California can't legislate how they serve a customer in a different state. They would have to comply when serving California customers within the state of California, regardless of where the dc is located. I.E. Under the CCPA it doesn't matter where my data is stored, they still have to delete it upon my request.

ApolloFortyNine 2y ago
>California can't legislate how they serve a customer in a different state. They would have to comply when serving California customers within the state of California, regardless of where the dc is located. I.E. Under the CCPA it doesn't matter where my data is stored, they still have to delete it upon my request. I know this is what California thinks, I just personally don't see how this isn't inter state commerce.
- TheCoelacanth 2y ago
  It is, of course, but that doesn't mean California can't regulate it; simply that federal laws take precedence. If states couldn't regulate interstate commerce taking place in their own states, they effectively couldn't regulate any commerce because court decisions have found that essentially all economic activity, even growing food for your own consumption, falls under the banner of interstate commerce.
  - dynm 2y ago
    > even growing food for your own consumption Hey I know this one! In case anyone is interested, here's the case: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wickard_v._Filburn https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wickard_v._Filburn
- arrosenberg 2y ago
  Unless their a superseding federal law, yeah, California can successfully prosecute businesses for breaking the laws within its' jurisdiction.

int_19h 2y ago

Interstate commerce clause by itself doesn't prevent it; it merely gives Congress the ability to override the state laws if Congress deems it necessary.

tmpz22 2y ago

Are you advocating to take the power relegated to the states away from the states and give it to the federal government in direct violation of the Constitution of the United States?

hiatus 2y ago
How is this not directly tied to interstate commerce (and copyright law) and thus under Congress' enumerated powers?
ApolloFortyNine 2y ago
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commerce_Clause https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commerce_Clause

armchairhacker 2y ago

Your argument for regulation is...reasons why it works out without regulation, and is already covered by existing regulations? Granted the "regulation" I'm referring to above is a law or EO to block California's regulation, and I don't support California's regulation either. But I believe regulations should only exist when there's no better alternative, because they usually have unintended consequences. If it's true that OpenAI can basically just leave California, the better alternative for the government may be doing nothing.