4 ms·

Though it wasn't directly mentioned in the article, the relevant context is that the Trump administration is in the process of cutting foreign aid by the US; se

• jerlam 2y ago
  The foreign aid provided by the US does not live in a void; China has been doing well in providing financial aid and loans across the world recently.
  • kulahan 2y ago
    This is not inherently a good thing, unless you believe that Chinese values are worth spreading over American ones. This is not to say that is or isn’t the case, just that it’s an effective end-result of letting them have massive influence globally. Additionally, many of China’s deals are meant to bring nations into serious debt, rather than to truly lift them up. Again, this may also be the case with the US, so the question is who you would rather be your creditor.
    • krapp 2y ago
      China doesn't spread "Chinese values" any more than America spreads "American values." America is an imperialist capitalist hegemon that exploits and oppresses other nations through debt, subterfuge or violence, and as China (which is very capitalistic, despite it's "communist" veneer) expands into the power vacuum created by America vacating its superpower status, it will inevitably do the same, probably in competition with a newly revived and militarized EU. So in the end, it doesn't matter whether America fucks you or China fucks you, or Europe fucks you, either way you're fucked.
      • kulahan 2y ago
        If you think I meant to imply that America doesn’t spread their values, despite numerous attempts throughout my comment to show that I didn’t in ANY way mean to imply that, you may want to reread my comment. I don’t mean this to be mean - I believe that you’re saying pretty much the same thing as me in your first comment re: filling the power vacuum. I also completely disagree. I’d rather be fucked by Europe or USA than China any day of the week. At least at the end of the day, we share vaguely similar values.
        • krapp 2y ago
          I am implying that America doesn't spread its values, because that isn't a thing that any country does. Nations don't have values, they have interests, and any premise to the contrary is just propaganda meant to manufacture consent for military adventurism and imperialism. People will support the premise of going to war in the Middle East to "spread democracy" far more than to "defend the petrodollar and distract the public from Saudi Arabia's complicity in 9/11," for instance.
          • kulahan 2y ago
            Nations are comprised of people who have values and elect representatives based on said values, was my point. Their own personal convictions don’t matter a WHOLE lot.
      • quanto 2y ago
        > oppresses other nations through debt, subterfuge or violence Could you provide a recent example (since 2000 if possible; if not, since WW2) where the US oppresses other nations through debt? I am genuinely curious.
        • Maxatar 2y ago
          There's no shortage of examples: Iraq, Egypt, Argentina, Pakistan, Philippines to name a few recent examples.
    • dismalaf 2y ago
      > Chinese values are worth spreading over American ones. Well the US seems to be allying itself with a murderous dictator and threatening to annex it's neighbours. China is less murderous than Russia, less warmongering and for those of us in Canada/EU, probably more reliable than a potentially fully-fascist US.
      • riehwvfbk 2y ago
        And that's why you carry out politically motivated arrests of Chinese citizens on orders from the US. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extradition_case_of_Meng_Wanzhou https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Extradition_case_of_Meng_Wan...
        • dismalaf 2y ago
          I mean, this wasn't particularly popular in Canada at the time. And yes, we did it for who we thought was our biggest ally, and the fallout definitely wasn't worth it, considering the charges were eventually dropped. Living in Canada and having European family I can tell you the attitudes towards both the US and China have shifted a lot recently.
          • riehwvfbk 2y ago
            The media at the time certainly disagreed: you were a "Chinese spy" if you doubted the wisdom of this arrest. Earlier, Chretien was called a traitor for not joining the war in Iraq (though history would show the wisdom of this decision later). Basically, Canada's recent history was the US saying "jump!" and Canada asking "how high?"
      • kulahan 2y ago
        China has active concen— er, “reeducation camps” for specific religious minorities. Others are required to replace photos of their icon with photos of Xi Jinping. The man implemented social credit scores and will warn neighbors of your bad behavior, to include encouraging shunning you. Dropping the score low enough is enough to get you banned from trains and planes. Political dissidents, highly respected lawmakers, and billionaires can disappear from public at the pleasure of the president. I sincerely hope you were simply speaking out of ignorance.
  • deadbabe 2y ago
    What China is doing is basically usury, it’s not the same. Stop glorifying China.