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India really needs to work on consciousness-raising regarding sanitation/cleanliness. Modi made a start in 2014. I don't know why the momentum stopped. Some of

India really needs to work on consciousness-raising regarding sanitation/cleanliness. Modi made a start in 2014. I don't know why the momentum stopped. Some of the videos coming out of there (e.g. the recent video of the railway employee throwing a huge amount of used disposable plastic food trays off a moving train) are shocking.

eclecticfrank 2y ago
India is on a steady path of improvement and has awareness campaigns running that adress these issues. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_supply_and_sanitation_in_India https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_supply_and_sanitation_in... https://innovateindia.mygov.in/toilet-campaign/ https://innovateindia.mygov.in/toilet-campaign/ https://siwi.org/latest/the-clean-india-mission-worlds-largest-sanitation-initiative/ https://siwi.org/latest/the-clean-india-mission-worlds-large...
- profsummergig 2y ago
  The recent Delhi election, I was watching videos of some of the slums. There were literal hills of rotting organic garbage inside the slums. With children living next to them. I had visions of Paul Ehrlich freaking out at the sight of people defecating and bathing on the roadside in Delhi. I saw photos of some of the "mohalla clinics" (free basic healthcare clinics) that the previous Delhi government had (admittedly admirably) set up. Some of them looked so dirty and structurally unsound that they wouldn't be allowed to function as holding pens for farm animals in the US. In the US, we have companies like Waste Management handle our waste. Surprises me that India doesn't have a dozen Waste Managements by now. Billion dollar unicorns/startups/whatever, innovating in turning "waste to wealth" (as Nitin Gadkari calls it). Put capitalism to use where there's a failure of non-capitalism to solve the problem. But there might be deep cultural issues. I suspect the caste system plays a part. The forward castes believe that trash management is beneath them.
  - navigate8310 2y ago
    I believe that's ingrained in the culture to live besides the filth and romanticize poverty.
    - profsummergig 2y ago
      There was a recent scandal involving someone spitting paan/chewing tobacco on the floor inside one of the state assemblies. A video I watched of a brand spanking new metro station in Mumbai. Marble floors and all. And a commenter pointed out a timestamp where you can see paan/chewing tobacco spit in a corner of the floor. Here's what baffles me. It is well established that Indians chew paan/chewing tobacco. It is well established that they then spit these out. Why don't they have spitoons installed inside the state assembly or metro stations? Treat it as a cultural opportunity: create beautiful spitoons with culturally relevant designs on them. The type kings used to have in their courts. And have them sponsored by businesses (i.e. let them post digital banner ads on them). Enlightened capitalism!
      - dartharva 2y ago
        That's because no politician wants to be the one "promoting tobacco products" with such an initiative.
      - lotsofpulp 2y ago
        Someone willing to spit their filthy tobacco saliva everywhere and anywhere is not going to go out of their way to use a spitoon.
      - thatloststudent 2y ago
        "The Ugly Indian" [1] (a ragtag group of anonymous citizens) usually does that in India. In reality, though, these kinds of issues are only really seen as a minor inconvenience at most. Anecdotally, most middle-class people in here frown upon chewing tobacco, so I assume the government thinks that as long as they keep it relatively clean, nobody would think of dirtying it with their paan stains. [1] - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tf1VA5jqmRo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tf1VA5jqmRo
- dartharva 2y ago
  Are you sure? Having lived all across the country (and currently in Mumbai), I haven't seen any progress on that part since at least the last half decade. The "Swacch Bharat" campaign that was launched more than a decade ago only gave some short-lived upgrades to public places.
kamaal 2y ago
>>I don't know why the momentum stopped. There was no momentum. People never started, it was more of a marketing campaign. Almost everyday I see people throw garbage around street corners, if you ask them not to, they gang up and go after you like its their birth right to be dirty and you are being evil by keeping clean. You need to tear down the whole shebang and rebuild it from scratch, much of this also about income levels of the ordinary Indian, and being so poor, keeping clean isn't any where in the list of priorities.
- Yeul 2y ago
  I'm someone who tends to keep to themselves but even I notice it when there are trash bags left behind by some asshole. Considering the lower wages it shouldn't be that expensive for an Indian city to hire some garbage collectors?
owebmaster 2y ago
> India really needs to work on consciousness-raising regarding sanitation/cleanliness. And women harassment. Maybe that should be the top1 priority.
- profsummergig 2y ago
  And that too. Bollywood movies are said to include r*pe scenes to increase sales. It's really sad.
nelblu 2y ago
I wouldn't say the momentum has stopped. Anecdote alert: I travel to India at least once in a year and I have to take the train each time (sleeper class) and I can definitely attest that things have significantly improved since I was a kid. I have been taking these same trains for over 25 years now. For starters the toilets actually don't dump directly between the tracks. The railway employees seem to be quite happy and take pride in their job (they used to always have depressing faces when I was growing up). Another anecdote : If 20 years ago you took a flight that goes to India, you would be frustrated with the condition of the toilets. It was so bad I used to avoid Indian carriers just because of that and intentionally take a layover in Europe so at least part of the flying experience would be cleaner. These days I don't feel that way, I find flights to India pretty much the same as any other flights. That said, there is still a LOT to be done, but I think overall people do seem to care about hygiene more than they used to years ago. Also, assuming there is always a certain percentage of population that will never care about this (in any country) it is bound to look a bit worse in India due to the higher population density.
- patja 2y ago
  Do they still spray down the aircraft cabin and passengers with insecticide?
- kamaal 2y ago
  >>For starters the toilets actually don't dump directly between the tracks. That's still there :) You don't cross(on a two wheeler) below a bridge on which a train is passing for the obvious reasons(Golden shower).
righthand 2y ago
Minor nitpick, there’s no such thing as disposable plastic.
sva_ 2y ago
> the recent video of the railway employee throwing a huge amount of used disposable plastic food trays off a moving train The video in question seems to be https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ci-QQaP2fSM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ci-QQaP2fSM It is pretty shocking, but at least not as shocking as garbage trucks dumping trash into the river (of which there are many online)

eclecticfrank 2y ago

India is on a steady path of improvement and has awareness campaigns running that adress these issues. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_supply_and_sanitation_in_India https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_supply_and_sanitation_in... https://innovateindia.mygov.in/toilet-campaign/ https://innovateindia.mygov.in/toilet-campaign/ https://siwi.org/latest/the-clean-india-mission-worlds-largest-sanitation-initiative/ https://siwi.org/latest/the-clean-india-mission-worlds-large...

profsummergig 2y ago
The recent Delhi election, I was watching videos of some of the slums. There were literal hills of rotting organic garbage inside the slums. With children living next to them. I had visions of Paul Ehrlich freaking out at the sight of people defecating and bathing on the roadside in Delhi. I saw photos of some of the "mohalla clinics" (free basic healthcare clinics) that the previous Delhi government had (admittedly admirably) set up. Some of them looked so dirty and structurally unsound that they wouldn't be allowed to function as holding pens for farm animals in the US. In the US, we have companies like Waste Management handle our waste. Surprises me that India doesn't have a dozen Waste Managements by now. Billion dollar unicorns/startups/whatever, innovating in turning "waste to wealth" (as Nitin Gadkari calls it). Put capitalism to use where there's a failure of non-capitalism to solve the problem. But there might be deep cultural issues. I suspect the caste system plays a part. The forward castes believe that trash management is beneath them.
- navigate8310 2y ago
  I believe that's ingrained in the culture to live besides the filth and romanticize poverty.
  - profsummergig 2y ago
    There was a recent scandal involving someone spitting paan/chewing tobacco on the floor inside one of the state assemblies. A video I watched of a brand spanking new metro station in Mumbai. Marble floors and all. And a commenter pointed out a timestamp where you can see paan/chewing tobacco spit in a corner of the floor. Here's what baffles me. It is well established that Indians chew paan/chewing tobacco. It is well established that they then spit these out. Why don't they have spitoons installed inside the state assembly or metro stations? Treat it as a cultural opportunity: create beautiful spitoons with culturally relevant designs on them. The type kings used to have in their courts. And have them sponsored by businesses (i.e. let them post digital banner ads on them). Enlightened capitalism!
    - dartharva 2y ago
      That's because no politician wants to be the one "promoting tobacco products" with such an initiative.
    - lotsofpulp 2y ago
      Someone willing to spit their filthy tobacco saliva everywhere and anywhere is not going to go out of their way to use a spitoon.
    - thatloststudent 2y ago
      "The Ugly Indian" [1] (a ragtag group of anonymous citizens) usually does that in India. In reality, though, these kinds of issues are only really seen as a minor inconvenience at most. Anecdotally, most middle-class people in here frown upon chewing tobacco, so I assume the government thinks that as long as they keep it relatively clean, nobody would think of dirtying it with their paan stains. [1] - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tf1VA5jqmRo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tf1VA5jqmRo
dartharva 2y ago
Are you sure? Having lived all across the country (and currently in Mumbai), I haven't seen any progress on that part since at least the last half decade. The "Swacch Bharat" campaign that was launched more than a decade ago only gave some short-lived upgrades to public places.

kamaal 2y ago

>>I don't know why the momentum stopped. There was no momentum. People never started, it was more of a marketing campaign. Almost everyday I see people throw garbage around street corners, if you ask them not to, they gang up and go after you like its their birth right to be dirty and you are being evil by keeping clean. You need to tear down the whole shebang and rebuild it from scratch, much of this also about income levels of the ordinary Indian, and being so poor, keeping clean isn't any where in the list of priorities.

Yeul 2y ago
I'm someone who tends to keep to themselves but even I notice it when there are trash bags left behind by some asshole. Considering the lower wages it shouldn't be that expensive for an Indian city to hire some garbage collectors?

owebmaster 2y ago

> India really needs to work on consciousness-raising regarding sanitation/cleanliness. And women harassment. Maybe that should be the top1 priority.

profsummergig 2y ago
And that too. Bollywood movies are said to include r*pe scenes to increase sales. It's really sad.

nelblu 2y ago

I wouldn't say the momentum has stopped. Anecdote alert: I travel to India at least once in a year and I have to take the train each time (sleeper class) and I can definitely attest that things have significantly improved since I was a kid. I have been taking these same trains for over 25 years now. For starters the toilets actually don't dump directly between the tracks. The railway employees seem to be quite happy and take pride in their job (they used to always have depressing faces when I was growing up). Another anecdote : If 20 years ago you took a flight that goes to India, you would be frustrated with the condition of the toilets. It was so bad I used to avoid Indian carriers just because of that and intentionally take a layover in Europe so at least part of the flying experience would be cleaner. These days I don't feel that way, I find flights to India pretty much the same as any other flights. That said, there is still a LOT to be done, but I think overall people do seem to care about hygiene more than they used to years ago. Also, assuming there is always a certain percentage of population that will never care about this (in any country) it is bound to look a bit worse in India due to the higher population density.

patja 2y ago
Do they still spray down the aircraft cabin and passengers with insecticide?
kamaal 2y ago
>>For starters the toilets actually don't dump directly between the tracks. That's still there :) You don't cross(on a two wheeler) below a bridge on which a train is passing for the obvious reasons(Golden shower).

righthand 2y ago

Minor nitpick, there’s no such thing as disposable plastic.

sva_ 2y ago

> the recent video of the railway employee throwing a huge amount of used disposable plastic food trays off a moving train The video in question seems to be https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ci-QQaP2fSM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ci-QQaP2fSM It is pretty shocking, but at least not as shocking as garbage trucks dumping trash into the river (of which there are many online)