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I can't help but feel a similarity to the entertainment industry's dynamics that sparked the meToo movement. The issues are different of course, but there are

I can't help but feel a similarity to the entertainment industry's dynamics that sparked the meToo movement. The issues are different of course, but there are common patterns of prestigious abusers, victims risking ostracism, etc. I wonder if we'll end up seeing a similar movement in academia were we spend a few months watching big names taken down from their pedestal every few days.

pjc50 2y ago
Academia also has, or has had, a metoo movement over actual sexual harassment and bullying. And of course the two are linked; if you can bully a young female researcher into not complaining about sexual harassment, you can bully her into complicity with your fraud. Attempts to address this are probably going to get swept away by the anti-DEI crackdown in the US. After all, not harassing your juniors is inclusivity.
- DontchaKnowit 2y ago
  I think thats a stretch. You think pro-DEI types are less likely to bully or harass? Cause Ive personally seen the exact opposite (people accusing people of racism as a means of retribution, or to advance their status, people in charge of DEI programs bullying or politicising their role, etc)
  - educasean 2y ago
    I don't know if people who will readily accuse others of racism as a tool of retribution can be considered genuinely serious about their DEI endorsement. Now with the winds changing directions under Trump administration 2.0, the same people are probably already denouncing their past and jumping onto the "DEI is bad" bandwagon.
    - DontchaKnowit 2y ago
      no true scotsmen, eh
      - educasean 2y ago
        It's a flimsy argument for sure. But we live in a reality where Meta, Google and other past bastion of progressive movements have taken a 180 turn upon Trump's first week of reign. Is it that much of a stretch to assume that a large swath of DEI champions around us were just parroting performative mantras? Maybe hypocrites are pretty obvious to spot for you. It's not as easy for me. I was shocked to find many of my peers turn their noses at DEI policies and act as if they've always been against it. Bandwagoners are going to bandwagon. I personally don't see much use in labelling them as anything else.
        lelanthran 2y ago
        > I was shocked to find many of my peers turn their noses at DEI policies and act as if they've always been against it. Why were you shocked? Are you new to the workforce? Did you never live through a time when criticising a company policy[1] was a serious CareerLimitingMove(tm)? Throw in the fact that people were both routinely and publicly punished for not jumping on the DEI bandwagon, and you have a large number of people who would rather keep their head down and get their work done in the most agreeable manner rather than tell you what they think. People aren't going to work to have their opinions validated, they're going to work to get money. They aren't going to jeopardise that money by going against the company vision (whatever that may be). [1] DEI or otherwise. Don't worry though, when the pendulum swings back these people would then present as supportive of DEI.

pjc50 2y ago

Academia also has, or has had, a metoo movement over actual sexual harassment and bullying. And of course the two are linked; if you can bully a young female researcher into not complaining about sexual harassment, you can bully her into complicity with your fraud. Attempts to address this are probably going to get swept away by the anti-DEI crackdown in the US. After all, not harassing your juniors is inclusivity.

DontchaKnowit 2y ago
I think thats a stretch. You think pro-DEI types are less likely to bully or harass? Cause Ive personally seen the exact opposite (people accusing people of racism as a means of retribution, or to advance their status, people in charge of DEI programs bullying or politicising their role, etc)
- educasean 2y ago
  I don't know if people who will readily accuse others of racism as a tool of retribution can be considered genuinely serious about their DEI endorsement. Now with the winds changing directions under Trump administration 2.0, the same people are probably already denouncing their past and jumping onto the "DEI is bad" bandwagon.
  - DontchaKnowit 2y ago
    no true scotsmen, eh
    - educasean 2y ago
      It's a flimsy argument for sure. But we live in a reality where Meta, Google and other past bastion of progressive movements have taken a 180 turn upon Trump's first week of reign. Is it that much of a stretch to assume that a large swath of DEI champions around us were just parroting performative mantras? Maybe hypocrites are pretty obvious to spot for you. It's not as easy for me. I was shocked to find many of my peers turn their noses at DEI policies and act as if they've always been against it. Bandwagoners are going to bandwagon. I personally don't see much use in labelling them as anything else.
      - lelanthran 2y ago
        > I was shocked to find many of my peers turn their noses at DEI policies and act as if they've always been against it. Why were you shocked? Are you new to the workforce? Did you never live through a time when criticising a company policy[1] was a serious CareerLimitingMove(tm)? Throw in the fact that people were both routinely and publicly punished for not jumping on the DEI bandwagon, and you have a large number of people who would rather keep their head down and get their work done in the most agreeable manner rather than tell you what they think. People aren't going to work to have their opinions validated, they're going to work to get money. They aren't going to jeopardise that money by going against the company vision (whatever that may be). [1] DEI or otherwise. Don't worry though, when the pendulum swings back these people would then present as supportive of DEI.