5 ms·

You are correct, food was exported outside of Ireland during this time period. This time was called the Hungry 40's and crop failures were happening all over Eu

by vondur 2y ago

You are correct, food was exported outside of Ireland during this time period. This time was called the Hungry 40's and crop failures were happening all over Europe. It lead to the Revolutions of 1848. Food was only available at prices that the poor could no longer afford.

ok_dad 2y ago
> Food was only available at prices that the poor could no longer afford. > It lead to the Revolutions of 1848. Too bad politicians today don't read the history books they want to burn, they might save their own skins.
- reverend_gonzo 2y ago
  Pretty sure donors line their pockets a lot more than the voting poor.
- vondur 2y ago
  Unfortunately the Revolutions of 1848 were violently suppressed. The forces of order were able to exploit the differences between the political reformers and the social reformers.
  - m4rtink 2y ago
    It still resulted in significant reforms in the end, even in Austria-Hungary, removing a lot of religion based persecution there for example.
throwawaymanbot 2y ago
Sounds like you are trying to explain away over a million deaths as if it was happening everywhere in Europe and not primarily the British fault. Fact: in 1847, nearly 4,000 vessels carried food from Ireland to British ports while hundreds of thousands of Irish people died of starvation and related diseases. There was PLENTY of food in Ireland. FACT: The government refused to intervene in the market to prevent food exports, even as the Irish population faced severe food shortages. Why? While crop failures were happening across Europe, the impact in Ireland was particularly devastating because of the population's heavy reliance on potatoes. The suggestion that food was only unaffordable for the poor overlooks the fact that the potato blight left many people without any access to their primary food source. WHY was it the only source of food in an abundant growing environment?? Fact: Wages paid on “work programs” for those (un)lucky enough to get on them were too low to purchase food at inflated "famine" prices, leading to widespread starvation. The export of food from Ireland during this period was a significant factor in the suffering of the Irish people, and it is important to acknowledge the role of British economic policies and the prioritization of profits over humanitarian needs which seems to be a struggle for you.
- verzali 2y ago
  The way this comment is written reads suspiciously like ChatGPT. And the name of the user has bot in it... You seem to contradict yourself as well, you say plenty of food, and then it was because of the reliance on potatoes, and then it was the only food source? Maybe I just dislike comments that insist on saying FACT multiple times.
  - throwawaymanbot 2y ago
    [dead]
I-M-S 2y ago
So like housing today. Future will not judge monetization of basic needs kindly.
- MikePlacid 2y ago
  I lived in a country where housing was provided for free (the Soviet Union), but monetization is so far superior—you wouldn’t believe the difference.
  - AstralStorm 2y ago
    Nice myth. Food wasn't quite provided for free. You did not get quite even basic rations enough to survive even if you were able to get them, further, due to mass exodus from farming to city, buildings were built there, and you had to wait a really long time, sometimes forever, to get a living space by lot. Similar with a car - it all operated under severe scarcity. All countries involved, even East Germany, had these problems. Workers got either in priority to farmers and further others. Except politicians and connected people got theirs first beyond workers. And some were able to buy it ahead of the queue. The magical development in the West was driven by really heavy handed subsidies industrial development on already richer area, which USSR just could not afford, and especially not after funding the high military spending. That notwithstanding some completely broken experiments done in large scale like attempts to farm the steppes in the middle of nowhere, a lot of which was funded by export from the few basket countries which would have otherwise had enough food. And after a relatively short while, the industrialization effort stalled, a variety of farming related problems appeared due to both mismanagement, bad weather and plagues, countries involved got indebted on bad terms... So yeah, it was "free".
    - skeletal88 2y ago
      Why the downvotes? This is correct
      - Kon5ole 2y ago
        I didn't vote but I guess the downvotes are because it calls the parent claim a "myth" and then goes on to agree with it. The scarcity that made food and housing not free in practice is why monetization (capitalism) ended up being better, which I assume was MikePlacid's point. Capitalism has problems for sure, but it eliminates scarcity more efficiently than any other system we have tried so far. Capitalism may share the abundance unevenly, but it still creates it in the first place, which is key.

by vondur 2y ago

ok_dad 2y ago

> Food was only available at prices that the poor could no longer afford. > It lead to the Revolutions of 1848. Too bad politicians today don't read the history books they want to burn, they might save their own skins.

reverend_gonzo 2y ago
Pretty sure donors line their pockets a lot more than the voting poor.
vondur 2y ago
Unfortunately the Revolutions of 1848 were violently suppressed. The forces of order were able to exploit the differences between the political reformers and the social reformers.
- m4rtink 2y ago
  It still resulted in significant reforms in the end, even in Austria-Hungary, removing a lot of religion based persecution there for example.

throwawaymanbot 2y ago

Sounds like you are trying to explain away over a million deaths as if it was happening everywhere in Europe and not primarily the British fault. Fact: in 1847, nearly 4,000 vessels carried food from Ireland to British ports while hundreds of thousands of Irish people died of starvation and related diseases. There was PLENTY of food in Ireland. FACT: The government refused to intervene in the market to prevent food exports, even as the Irish population faced severe food shortages. Why? While crop failures were happening across Europe, the impact in Ireland was particularly devastating because of the population's heavy reliance on potatoes. The suggestion that food was only unaffordable for the poor overlooks the fact that the potato blight left many people without any access to their primary food source. WHY was it the only source of food in an abundant growing environment?? Fact: Wages paid on “work programs” for those (un)lucky enough to get on them were too low to purchase food at inflated "famine" prices, leading to widespread starvation. The export of food from Ireland during this period was a significant factor in the suffering of the Irish people, and it is important to acknowledge the role of British economic policies and the prioritization of profits over humanitarian needs which seems to be a struggle for you.

verzali 2y ago
The way this comment is written reads suspiciously like ChatGPT. And the name of the user has bot in it... You seem to contradict yourself as well, you say plenty of food, and then it was because of the reliance on potatoes, and then it was the only food source? Maybe I just dislike comments that insist on saying FACT multiple times.
- throwawaymanbot 2y ago
  [dead]

I-M-S 2y ago

So like housing today. Future will not judge monetization of basic needs kindly.

MikePlacid 2y ago
I lived in a country where housing was provided for free (the Soviet Union), but monetization is so far superior—you wouldn’t believe the difference.
- AstralStorm 2y ago
  Nice myth. Food wasn't quite provided for free. You did not get quite even basic rations enough to survive even if you were able to get them, further, due to mass exodus from farming to city, buildings were built there, and you had to wait a really long time, sometimes forever, to get a living space by lot. Similar with a car - it all operated under severe scarcity. All countries involved, even East Germany, had these problems. Workers got either in priority to farmers and further others. Except politicians and connected people got theirs first beyond workers. And some were able to buy it ahead of the queue. The magical development in the West was driven by really heavy handed subsidies industrial development on already richer area, which USSR just could not afford, and especially not after funding the high military spending. That notwithstanding some completely broken experiments done in large scale like attempts to farm the steppes in the middle of nowhere, a lot of which was funded by export from the few basket countries which would have otherwise had enough food. And after a relatively short while, the industrialization effort stalled, a variety of farming related problems appeared due to both mismanagement, bad weather and plagues, countries involved got indebted on bad terms... So yeah, it was "free".
  - skeletal88 2y ago
    Why the downvotes? This is correct
    - Kon5ole 2y ago
      I didn't vote but I guess the downvotes are because it calls the parent claim a "myth" and then goes on to agree with it. The scarcity that made food and housing not free in practice is why monetization (capitalism) ended up being better, which I assume was MikePlacid's point. Capitalism has problems for sure, but it eliminates scarcity more efficiently than any other system we have tried so far. Capitalism may share the abundance unevenly, but it still creates it in the first place, which is key.