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Yeah, apparently he's talked about "negotiating down the national debt"? [1] How the fuck would that even work? Would he just tell all the Americans holding tr

Yeah, apparently he's talked about "negotiating down the national debt"? [1] How the fuck would that even work? Would he just tell all the Americans holding treasury bills that they're only going to get half of their money back? I think that would completely erode any confidence in the US economy, both domestically and internationally. [1] https://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/07/us/politics/donald-trumps-idea-to-cut-national-debt-get-creditors-to-accept-less.html https://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/07/us/politics/donald-trumps...

relaxing 2y ago
Yes, and it will work, because we’ve got the nukes.
- tombert 2y ago
  Isn't the majority of US debt held by Americans by means of bonds and treasury bills? I think it's about 2/3 of the total US debt, if I'm reading that right. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_debt_of_the_United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_debt_of_the_United_St... I would really hope that Trump doesn't start nuking the US.
  - relaxing 2y ago
    No, it’s like 1/3 foreign, 1/3 domestic, 1/3 the Fed and other money moving between federal agencies. Presumably the latter would be a wash. Then of the domestic holdings, a big chunk is state and city holdings. Institutional investors would be mad. Citizens with saving bonds and/or money tied up in t-bills thanks to reddit are a tiny fraction.
    - tombert 2y ago
      Even still, if we assume that the fed is a wash, that suggests that half of the remainder is domestic. I don't think that the orange idiot would start nuking the US. Oh god, I really hope that he's not quite that stupid.
- quadragenarian 2y ago
  Well one of the reasons we can be so spendthrift in this country is our financing rates staying so low despite massive amounts of debt. This is due to confidence by global investors and asset managers in the US's economy and ability to pay back its debts. The US can try to renegotiate or not pay, but that's an overt signal to investors that the US is not reliable and will result in the 10-year Treasury bond rate soaring, probably permanently, which will decimate our country's credit and is an own goal that we probably wouldn't be able to come back from economically.
  - relaxing 2y ago
    > The US can try to renegotiate or not pay, but that's an overt signal to investors that the US is not reliable and will result in the 10-year Treasury bond rate soaring The 10 year rate is not a force of nature. It is set at auction by investors who believe US t-bonds are a safer resting place than those of the economies that were destroyed by the nukes.
- verzali 2y ago
  So did the USSR and things worked out great for them.
chneu 2y ago
Trump pushes the lie that China owns a large amount of our debt. It's a racist dog whistle. In reality, most of the US debt is owned by Americans and American businesses. Renegotiating the US debt would basically rob Americans of money.

relaxing 2y ago

Yes, and it will work, because we’ve got the nukes.

tombert 2y ago
Isn't the majority of US debt held by Americans by means of bonds and treasury bills? I think it's about 2/3 of the total US debt, if I'm reading that right. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_debt_of_the_United_States https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_debt_of_the_United_St... I would really hope that Trump doesn't start nuking the US.
- relaxing 2y ago
  No, it’s like 1/3 foreign, 1/3 domestic, 1/3 the Fed and other money moving between federal agencies. Presumably the latter would be a wash. Then of the domestic holdings, a big chunk is state and city holdings. Institutional investors would be mad. Citizens with saving bonds and/or money tied up in t-bills thanks to reddit are a tiny fraction.
  - tombert 2y ago
    Even still, if we assume that the fed is a wash, that suggests that half of the remainder is domestic. I don't think that the orange idiot would start nuking the US. Oh god, I really hope that he's not quite that stupid.
quadragenarian 2y ago
Well one of the reasons we can be so spendthrift in this country is our financing rates staying so low despite massive amounts of debt. This is due to confidence by global investors and asset managers in the US's economy and ability to pay back its debts. The US can try to renegotiate or not pay, but that's an overt signal to investors that the US is not reliable and will result in the 10-year Treasury bond rate soaring, probably permanently, which will decimate our country's credit and is an own goal that we probably wouldn't be able to come back from economically.
- relaxing 2y ago
  > The US can try to renegotiate or not pay, but that's an overt signal to investors that the US is not reliable and will result in the 10-year Treasury bond rate soaring The 10 year rate is not a force of nature. It is set at auction by investors who believe US t-bonds are a safer resting place than those of the economies that were destroyed by the nukes.
verzali 2y ago
So did the USSR and things worked out great for them.

chneu 2y ago

Trump pushes the lie that China owns a large amount of our debt. It's a racist dog whistle. In reality, most of the US debt is owned by Americans and American businesses. Renegotiating the US debt would basically rob Americans of money.