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Do you think the board will push Elon out, or will the company just collapse when it can't raise cash? I kinda want to buy a used Tesla now while they're cheap

Do you think the board will push Elon out, or will the company just collapse when it can't raise cash? I kinda want to buy a used Tesla now while they're cheap and stash it in the garage until this blows over. But I need it to keep getting software support.

ericjmorey 2y ago
Maybe Russian and Middle Eastern money bails him out again.
leptons 2y ago
The brand is forever tainted by "Dark Gothic MAGA".
- willsmith72 2y ago
  it is, and for moral reasons i wouldn't buy one new. but i've had the same thought as parent. if the 2nd hand market really dips, i'm not going to let dirty looks from strangers get in the way of a smart economic & ecological move for me
  - leptons 2y ago
    I'm sure Musk would send you a sieg heil for doing it.
    - willsmith72 2y ago
      i mean what do they get from buying a second hand car? i'll have solar soon, will very rarely need the charging network
      - tobias3 2y ago
        Resale value plays into buy decisions
  - pesus 2y ago
    I would be concerned about more than dirty looks at the rate things are going.
- jodrellblank 2y ago
  Forever? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volkswagen#History https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volkswagen#History
  - seper8 2y ago
    The leader of the nazis was murdered, so were most of the hardcore loyalists and his soldiers. If Hitler and his loyalists were still around chilling in Argentina I'm sure Volkswagen wouldn't do so well.
    - leptons 2y ago
      >The leader of the nazis was murdered He killed himself like the coward he was.
  - leptons 2y ago
    Kind of funny how similar Musk and Hitler really are. If the board of Tesla ditched Musk instead of giving him 50 billion dollars, the company might have saved face. But no. I'm seeing a lot of "we bought this before we knew Elon was crazy" bumper stickers lately, as well as a few aquaintances trying to sell their Teslas and the stock they have in the company. Tesla's days are numbered, unless Musk forces the US government to buy them, which he probably will do.
DougN7 2y ago
I’m going to guess they won’t work if they turn the Tesla servers off. Just a guess - I have no inside info.
- toomuchtodo 2y ago
  They will, I’ve tested it by turning my cellular connectivity on the vehicle off (I have root on my vehicles as a registered security researcher). You lose maps, supercharger status, etc but the car still works fine.
vessenes 2y ago
Tesla's 2024 Free Cash Flow was roughly $3.5 billion. Other than BYD, they're still the only company I'm aware of that can profitably sell an EV. So, raising cash might not be a near-term pressure point. The board's historically comped Elon on revenues, net income and stock price -- all those aren't that great compared with highs in the last five years. They are, however, astronomical compared to where Tesla was when they gave him his 'crazy' incentive stock plan. I imagine the board is probably repeatedly asking him to settle down, lower the drug intake and ... please don't make things worse bro. Maybe in stronger language than that. And, I'm sure if they think Tesla would be better off without Elon they'll work hard to make that happen. Right now, though is sort of peak anti-Elon sentiment in the public, making it harder to parse out what's helpful / where he's impacting his companies on the non-public side.
- YokoZar 2y ago
  Without a strong theory for why anti-Elon sentiment can't get worse, it's quite plausible we haven't actually hit the "peak" of it. Personally I think it quite likely that Musk will catch significant blame for whatever bad things related to American government happen in the coming year, deserved or otherwise.
  - miohtama 2y ago
    Also a clash with Trump or other MAGA figureheads is likely and Musk will be kicked out from the MAGA team.
oriel 2y ago
That's always been the catch for me; its an always-on remotely controlled camera-mobile, of which you happen to sit in the drivers seat and pretend you own while it drives you around dangerously.
- averageRoyalty 2y ago
  Aside from the gimmicky "summon mode", what remote control are you talking about?
  - oriel 2y ago
    Simply being always-online and sending telemetry, doesnt preclude the ability to remotely intercede in the car's operations. I think there's precedent with the OnStar system in other cars, and there has anecdotally been evidence of various systems being operable by some kind of admin terminal. I think "summon mode" is actually a great demonstration of how you can remotely access and do some form of piloting the car without a driver. There's also the disabling of features remotely on resale, and probably other examples.
  - tobias3 2y ago
    They probably do it properly now, but there were stories in the past that they were able to ssh into the cars: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17835760 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17835760 https://www.reddit.com/r/EnoughMuskSpam/comments/99sbwa/former_tesla_programmers_anecdotes_about_problems/ https://www.reddit.com/r/EnoughMuskSpam/comments/99sbwa/form... Even then you can always install an update that allows remote control.
    - averageRoyalty 2y ago
      Into the infotainment unit. I guess it's a question of your definition of "remote control". In the context of a car, I'd think that more than being able to change the aircon or turn up the volume.
bryanlarsen 2y ago
Tesla has $36B in cash. They don't need to raise.
- thrill 2y ago
  Not too many years ago I watched Ford burn $36 billion in cash in a year.
alabastervlog 2y ago
Dude sieg-heiled twice on stage. He needs to have no connection, including stock, and they need a rebrand, before I’d consider them. The T logo is a swastika now, and I would’ve drive around with one of those on my car.
- josteink 2y ago
  This is clearly misinformation, and repeating it won’t make it true. He said «my heart goes out to you». Without a video of him saying that nobody would have blinked an eye at the contents of what he said. You know, content, the thing Martin Luther King said we should judge people by. This is a pretty bad problem (or «strategy») with the modern left. They imagine something into existence, either now, or more commonly in a vague future. They then base their political platform on these imagined or assumed things. They do this all the time. The Elon nazi thing is probably the most extreme and obvious case I’ve seen of this, and I’m honestly shocked to see the amount of people taking it seriously. The left should, like Bill Maher recently said, focus on providing a viable alternative instead of trying to see who can act the most unhinged.
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
  - wat10000 2y ago
    Don’t be so damned gullible. These shitheads thrive on doing reprehensible stuff, and then giving it a stupid cover story so people like you go out and defend them for free. It was a “haha only serious” Nazi salute. It’s not “unhinged” to see what’s plainly visible.
  - ailun 2y ago
    Nah. Not misinformation. Just other people aren't willing to give him the massive benefit of the doubt that you are. There's no point arguing with you about it, of course. But in context, watching the full video, seeing his opinions expressed on Twitter... surely you can see how people can come to the conclusion that they have. For you to act like it's 100% definitely misinformation rather than a judgement call is disingenuous to the extreme.
akmarinov 2y ago
The board is die hard Elon loyalists, for example - his brother. The board’s not doing anything
xyst 2y ago
If TSLA goes bust, your car will cease to function. This is guaranteed, m8. Don't buy this junk.
- averageRoyalty 2y ago
  What is your basis for this? This sounds like rubbish. I would imagine the car would function as well as any other manufactuter who runs their own entertainment system - some hosted features might fail, but the car itself will continue to run fine.
  - bloomingkales 2y ago
    You ever get software updates for legacy software? Not really right? The term is abandonware. In the video game market what they do is hand off the dead games to some Chinese company that milks a few more DLCs/cashshops out of it (this re-release is effectively a pump and dump IPO). Then they pack it up and shut the game down. The timeline would like this for a Tesla owner: - Tesla goes bankrupt - Some Chinese company takes up the upkeep of the software - They introduce ads similar to Jeep - No core functionality or QoL improvements are made - Abandonware, no real software updates - Your car runs fine, but you paid for a car with a computer in it, and the business basically repossessed the computer part of it. So, if that's possible, it's better to avoid.
    - wat10000 2y ago
      I don’t need updates, so step three is where I disconnect the car and keep driving it like that. There haven’t been any significant updates to the software in the past couple of years anyway, outside of FSD.
    - averageRoyalty 2y ago
      If key functionality changes, I have a right to refund under Austalian consumer law. If the new owners refused to comply, they'd end up being barred from trading in Australia. Regardless - even in this fairly far fetched reality - as you said the "car runs fine", but the GO was refering to the car "ceasing to function".
prepend 2y ago
Are they cheap though? I’ve been searching on AT and Craigslist and prices don’t seem to have dropped yet.

ericjmorey 2y ago

Maybe Russian and Middle Eastern money bails him out again.

leptons 2y ago

The brand is forever tainted by "Dark Gothic MAGA".

willsmith72 2y ago
it is, and for moral reasons i wouldn't buy one new. but i've had the same thought as parent. if the 2nd hand market really dips, i'm not going to let dirty looks from strangers get in the way of a smart economic & ecological move for me
- leptons 2y ago
  I'm sure Musk would send you a sieg heil for doing it.
  - willsmith72 2y ago
    i mean what do they get from buying a second hand car? i'll have solar soon, will very rarely need the charging network
    - tobias3 2y ago
      Resale value plays into buy decisions
- pesus 2y ago
  I would be concerned about more than dirty looks at the rate things are going.
jodrellblank 2y ago
Forever? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volkswagen#History https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volkswagen#History
- seper8 2y ago
  The leader of the nazis was murdered, so were most of the hardcore loyalists and his soldiers. If Hitler and his loyalists were still around chilling in Argentina I'm sure Volkswagen wouldn't do so well.
  - leptons 2y ago
    >The leader of the nazis was murdered He killed himself like the coward he was.
- leptons 2y ago
  Kind of funny how similar Musk and Hitler really are. If the board of Tesla ditched Musk instead of giving him 50 billion dollars, the company might have saved face. But no. I'm seeing a lot of "we bought this before we knew Elon was crazy" bumper stickers lately, as well as a few aquaintances trying to sell their Teslas and the stock they have in the company. Tesla's days are numbered, unless Musk forces the US government to buy them, which he probably will do.

DougN7 2y ago

I’m going to guess they won’t work if they turn the Tesla servers off. Just a guess - I have no inside info.

toomuchtodo 2y ago
They will, I’ve tested it by turning my cellular connectivity on the vehicle off (I have root on my vehicles as a registered security researcher). You lose maps, supercharger status, etc but the car still works fine.

vessenes 2y ago

Tesla's 2024 Free Cash Flow was roughly $3.5 billion. Other than BYD, they're still the only company I'm aware of that can profitably sell an EV. So, raising cash might not be a near-term pressure point. The board's historically comped Elon on revenues, net income and stock price -- all those aren't that great compared with highs in the last five years. They are, however, astronomical compared to where Tesla was when they gave him his 'crazy' incentive stock plan. I imagine the board is probably repeatedly asking him to settle down, lower the drug intake and ... please don't make things worse bro. Maybe in stronger language than that. And, I'm sure if they think Tesla would be better off without Elon they'll work hard to make that happen. Right now, though is sort of peak anti-Elon sentiment in the public, making it harder to parse out what's helpful / where he's impacting his companies on the non-public side.

YokoZar 2y ago
Without a strong theory for why anti-Elon sentiment can't get worse, it's quite plausible we haven't actually hit the "peak" of it. Personally I think it quite likely that Musk will catch significant blame for whatever bad things related to American government happen in the coming year, deserved or otherwise.
- miohtama 2y ago
  Also a clash with Trump or other MAGA figureheads is likely and Musk will be kicked out from the MAGA team.

oriel 2y ago

That's always been the catch for me; its an always-on remotely controlled camera-mobile, of which you happen to sit in the drivers seat and pretend you own while it drives you around dangerously.

averageRoyalty 2y ago
Aside from the gimmicky "summon mode", what remote control are you talking about?
- oriel 2y ago
  Simply being always-online and sending telemetry, doesnt preclude the ability to remotely intercede in the car's operations. I think there's precedent with the OnStar system in other cars, and there has anecdotally been evidence of various systems being operable by some kind of admin terminal. I think "summon mode" is actually a great demonstration of how you can remotely access and do some form of piloting the car without a driver. There's also the disabling of features remotely on resale, and probably other examples.
- tobias3 2y ago
  They probably do it properly now, but there were stories in the past that they were able to ssh into the cars: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17835760 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17835760 https://www.reddit.com/r/EnoughMuskSpam/comments/99sbwa/former_tesla_programmers_anecdotes_about_problems/ https://www.reddit.com/r/EnoughMuskSpam/comments/99sbwa/form... Even then you can always install an update that allows remote control.
  - averageRoyalty 2y ago
    Into the infotainment unit. I guess it's a question of your definition of "remote control". In the context of a car, I'd think that more than being able to change the aircon or turn up the volume.

bryanlarsen 2y ago

Tesla has $36B in cash. They don't need to raise.

thrill 2y ago
Not too many years ago I watched Ford burn $36 billion in cash in a year.

alabastervlog 2y ago

Dude sieg-heiled twice on stage. He needs to have no connection, including stock, and they need a rebrand, before I’d consider them. The T logo is a swastika now, and I would’ve drive around with one of those on my car.

josteink 2y ago
This is clearly misinformation, and repeating it won’t make it true. He said «my heart goes out to you». Without a video of him saying that nobody would have blinked an eye at the contents of what he said. You know, content, the thing Martin Luther King said we should judge people by. This is a pretty bad problem (or «strategy») with the modern left. They imagine something into existence, either now, or more commonly in a vague future. They then base their political platform on these imagined or assumed things. They do this all the time. The Elon nazi thing is probably the most extreme and obvious case I’ve seen of this, and I’m honestly shocked to see the amount of people taking it seriously. The left should, like Bill Maher recently said, focus on providing a viable alternative instead of trying to see who can act the most unhinged.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
- wat10000 2y ago
  Don’t be so damned gullible. These shitheads thrive on doing reprehensible stuff, and then giving it a stupid cover story so people like you go out and defend them for free. It was a “haha only serious” Nazi salute. It’s not “unhinged” to see what’s plainly visible.
- ailun 2y ago
  Nah. Not misinformation. Just other people aren't willing to give him the massive benefit of the doubt that you are. There's no point arguing with you about it, of course. But in context, watching the full video, seeing his opinions expressed on Twitter... surely you can see how people can come to the conclusion that they have. For you to act like it's 100% definitely misinformation rather than a judgement call is disingenuous to the extreme.

akmarinov 2y ago

The board is die hard Elon loyalists, for example - his brother. The board’s not doing anything

xyst 2y ago

If TSLA goes bust, your car will cease to function. This is guaranteed, m8. Don't buy this junk.

averageRoyalty 2y ago
What is your basis for this? This sounds like rubbish. I would imagine the car would function as well as any other manufactuter who runs their own entertainment system - some hosted features might fail, but the car itself will continue to run fine.
- bloomingkales 2y ago
  You ever get software updates for legacy software? Not really right? The term is abandonware. In the video game market what they do is hand off the dead games to some Chinese company that milks a few more DLCs/cashshops out of it (this re-release is effectively a pump and dump IPO). Then they pack it up and shut the game down. The timeline would like this for a Tesla owner: - Tesla goes bankrupt - Some Chinese company takes up the upkeep of the software - They introduce ads similar to Jeep - No core functionality or QoL improvements are made - Abandonware, no real software updates - Your car runs fine, but you paid for a car with a computer in it, and the business basically repossessed the computer part of it. So, if that's possible, it's better to avoid.
  - wat10000 2y ago
    I don’t need updates, so step three is where I disconnect the car and keep driving it like that. There haven’t been any significant updates to the software in the past couple of years anyway, outside of FSD.
  - averageRoyalty 2y ago
    If key functionality changes, I have a right to refund under Austalian consumer law. If the new owners refused to comply, they'd end up being barred from trading in Australia. Regardless - even in this fairly far fetched reality - as you said the "car runs fine", but the GO was refering to the car "ceasing to function".

prepend 2y ago

Are they cheap though? I’ve been searching on AT and Craigslist and prices don’t seem to have dropped yet.