4 ms·

I am vegan, have been for five years, I don't eat faux meat and never would. However, good for them. Meat is environmentally unsustainable and is unhealthy (fo

I am vegan, have been for five years, I don't eat faux meat and never would. However, good for them. Meat is environmentally unsustainable and is unhealthy (for both givers and receivers).

zacharycohn 14y ago
"Meat is environmentally unsustainable and is unhealthy." Citation needed. Soy/Tofu, on the other hand, IS unhealthy - particularly for men.[1][2] [1] - http://www.menshealth.com/nutrition/soys-negative-effects http://www.menshealth.com/nutrition/soys-negative-effects [2] - http://www.healthiertalk.com/why-tofu-wrecks-your-brain-0246 http://www.healthiertalk.com/why-tofu-wrecks-your-brain-0246
- wahnfrieden 14y ago
  Men's Health is not a suitable citation.
  - VMG 14y ago
    From the article: > Dr. Lewi's case report on James Price's condition was published in the May/June 2008 edition of Endocrine Practice, a journal read by many of the nation's in-the-trenches endocrinologists. Thanks to this, doctors now have a newly documented agent to consider when evaluating gynecomastia.
- jessedhillon 14y ago
  WTF, Men's Health magazine and some health forum article (whose author believes water fluoridation is an industrial conspiracy) are considered reliable sources now? By these standards, the case for the unsustainable and unhealthy nature of meat is airtight. But if you want a more reliable source, seek out the UNEP report on sustainable resource management.
  - protomyth 14y ago
    A better reference for tofu would be http://www.jacn.org/content/19/2/242.full http://www.jacn.org/content/19/2/242.full
    - jessedhillon 14y ago
      Yes the JACN article is at least a scientific study. It is one data point however, and AFAIK the only study to find a link between soy intake and decreased cognition -- compared with a large body of research that has associated intake of soy isoflavones with better health, including better cognition. These include studies of typical Asian diets, which are known to be higher in soy than Western diets. If one was to look at the entire scientific literature honestly and soberly, I think the evidence would overwhelmingly support the claim for soy health benefits.
    - mangodrunk 14y ago
      That is the one study often used, but I haven't seen others. One study shouldn't be used to conclusively say something is bad or healthy. So are there similar issues in cultures that do consume more soy?
- 27182818284 14y ago
  You incorrectly assume Mens Health is a source and incorrectly assume that the alternative to meat is soy. For example, if you don't eat hamburgers you aren't forced into soy burgers. It doesn't work like that.
  - sp332 14y ago
    The fake meat this article discusses is soy-based.
    - 27182818284 14y ago
      "Instead of just relying on soy, we want to use lupin, mustard seed protein, and barley to give consumers a broad range of plant-based proteins."
- VMG 14y ago
  Thanks for the link. I have heard about this but always thought the risk was negligible.
- deleted 14y ago
  [deleted]
- pbreit 14y ago
  Here's the first of 12 million results for "red meat unhealthy": http://articles.latimes.com/2012/mar/14/news/la-heb-red-meat-why-bad-20120314 http://articles.latimes.com/2012/mar/14/news/la-heb-red-meat... There is also lots of material on how much more expensive meat product is. Here's just one: http://www.ajcn.org/content/78/3/660S.full http://www.ajcn.org/content/78/3/660S.full The two articles you list are not particularly compelling.
  - bryanlarsen 14y ago
    That article states that one of the hypotheses of why red meat is unhealthy is because of the preservatives used in processed meat. I'm sure almost everybody will agree that processed meats are unhealthy. But please don't say that red meat is unhealthy just because processed meats are usually made from red meat.
- HSO 14y ago
  > Citation needed. How about the FAO: This report aims to assess the full impact of the livestock sector on environmental problems, along with potential technical and policy approaches to mitigation. The assessment is based on the most recent and complete data available, taking into account direct impacts, along with the impacts of feedcrop agriculture required for livestock production. The livestock sector emerges as one of the top two or three most significant contributors to the most serious environmental problems, at every scale from local to global. The findings of this report suggest that it should be a major policy focus when dealing with problems of land degradation, climate change and air pollution, water shortage and water pollution and loss of biodiversity. Livestock’s contribution to environmental problems is on a massive scale and its poten- tial contribution to their solution is equally large. The impact is so significant that it needs to be addressed with urgency. Major reductions in impact could be achieved at reasonable cost. http://www.fao.org/docrep/010/a0701e/a0701e00.HTM http://www.fao.org/docrep/010/a0701e/a0701e00.HTM

I am vegan, have been for five years, I don't eat faux meat and never would. However, good for them. Meat is environmentally unsustainable and is unhealthy (for both givers and receivers).

zacharycohn 14y ago

"Meat is environmentally unsustainable and is unhealthy." Citation needed. Soy/Tofu, on the other hand, IS unhealthy - particularly for men.[1][2] [1] - http://www.menshealth.com/nutrition/soys-negative-effects http://www.menshealth.com/nutrition/soys-negative-effects [2] - http://www.healthiertalk.com/why-tofu-wrecks-your-brain-0246 http://www.healthiertalk.com/why-tofu-wrecks-your-brain-0246

wahnfrieden 14y ago
Men's Health is not a suitable citation.
- VMG 14y ago
  From the article: > Dr. Lewi's case report on James Price's condition was published in the May/June 2008 edition of Endocrine Practice, a journal read by many of the nation's in-the-trenches endocrinologists. Thanks to this, doctors now have a newly documented agent to consider when evaluating gynecomastia.
jessedhillon 14y ago
WTF, Men's Health magazine and some health forum article (whose author believes water fluoridation is an industrial conspiracy) are considered reliable sources now? By these standards, the case for the unsustainable and unhealthy nature of meat is airtight. But if you want a more reliable source, seek out the UNEP report on sustainable resource management.
- protomyth 14y ago
  A better reference for tofu would be http://www.jacn.org/content/19/2/242.full http://www.jacn.org/content/19/2/242.full
  - jessedhillon 14y ago
    Yes the JACN article is at least a scientific study. It is one data point however, and AFAIK the only study to find a link between soy intake and decreased cognition -- compared with a large body of research that has associated intake of soy isoflavones with better health, including better cognition. These include studies of typical Asian diets, which are known to be higher in soy than Western diets. If one was to look at the entire scientific literature honestly and soberly, I think the evidence would overwhelmingly support the claim for soy health benefits.
  - mangodrunk 14y ago
    That is the one study often used, but I haven't seen others. One study shouldn't be used to conclusively say something is bad or healthy. So are there similar issues in cultures that do consume more soy?
27182818284 14y ago
You incorrectly assume Mens Health is a source and incorrectly assume that the alternative to meat is soy. For example, if you don't eat hamburgers you aren't forced into soy burgers. It doesn't work like that.
- sp332 14y ago
  The fake meat this article discusses is soy-based.
  - 27182818284 14y ago
    "Instead of just relying on soy, we want to use lupin, mustard seed protein, and barley to give consumers a broad range of plant-based proteins."
VMG 14y ago
Thanks for the link. I have heard about this but always thought the risk was negligible.
deleted 14y ago
[deleted]
pbreit 14y ago
Here's the first of 12 million results for "red meat unhealthy": http://articles.latimes.com/2012/mar/14/news/la-heb-red-meat-why-bad-20120314 http://articles.latimes.com/2012/mar/14/news/la-heb-red-meat... There is also lots of material on how much more expensive meat product is. Here's just one: http://www.ajcn.org/content/78/3/660S.full http://www.ajcn.org/content/78/3/660S.full The two articles you list are not particularly compelling.
- bryanlarsen 14y ago
  That article states that one of the hypotheses of why red meat is unhealthy is because of the preservatives used in processed meat. I'm sure almost everybody will agree that processed meats are unhealthy. But please don't say that red meat is unhealthy just because processed meats are usually made from red meat.
HSO 14y ago
> Citation needed. How about the FAO: This report aims to assess the full impact of the livestock sector on environmental problems, along with potential technical and policy approaches to mitigation. The assessment is based on the most recent and complete data available, taking into account direct impacts, along with the impacts of feedcrop agriculture required for livestock production. The livestock sector emerges as one of the top two or three most significant contributors to the most serious environmental problems, at every scale from local to global. The findings of this report suggest that it should be a major policy focus when dealing with problems of land degradation, climate change and air pollution, water shortage and water pollution and loss of biodiversity. Livestock’s contribution to environmental problems is on a massive scale and its poten- tial contribution to their solution is equally large. The impact is so significant that it needs to be addressed with urgency. Major reductions in impact could be achieved at reasonable cost. http://www.fao.org/docrep/010/a0701e/a0701e00.HTM http://www.fao.org/docrep/010/a0701e/a0701e00.HTM