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Loath as I am to give 4chan credit for anything positive, I feel like the article subject is slightly dismissive with its use of the phrase "stumbled upon." The

Loath as I am to give 4chan credit for anything positive, I feel like the article subject is slightly dismissive with its use of the phrase "stumbled upon." The anonymous 4chan user clearly did the work, it's not as though they came upon a proof written in the sand. For all we know it was a grad student with an ABD in Statistics who just happened to like anime. But the phrasing almost implies it's not a true accomplishment because "scientists" didn't discover it.

asddubs 2y ago
i took it to mean that they stumbled upon it in the sense that they didn't try to make a novel contribution to the field of mathematics or think they were doing that, but just solving a specific problem
- AdmiralAsshat 2y ago
  I suppose in my head, when the phrase "stumbled upon" is used, it would imply that someone was solving a problem that they weren't intending to solve, or via a method that they weren't intending. A hypothetical headline might be "Food scientist stumbles upon cure for cancer while refining process for fish oil": the scientist wasn't trying to solve the problem of cancer, they were trying to solve the problem of extending fish oil shelf-life, and incidentally found the former. But you would find it strange if the article said, "Oncologist stumbles upon cure for cancer while testing new colon cancer treatment." Because in that case, the scientist is seemingly doing what he set out to do--it was not unintentional. It seems like the 4chan poster knew enough about mathematics to recognize the stated problem as a mathematical problem and write a proof for it. That already demonstrates a degree of specialty and intention that makes "stumble upon" seem dismissive, to me. The fact that they didn't know they were solving a a more general, already-known problem is irrelevant, IMO. It would almost be like denying them credit because they didn't fill out the paperwork correctly.
  - Arnavion 2y ago
    "Stumbled upon" is used for mathematicians discovering something by working it out all the time.
  - thaumasiotes 2y ago
    > But you would find it strange if the article said, "Oncologist stumbles upon cure for cancer while testing new colon cancer treatment." Because in that case, the scientist is seemingly doing what he set out to do--it was not unintentional. I wouldn't really find that strange. Finding a cure for cancer is not an expected outcome of testing a cancer treatment and certainly isn't what the oncologist is trying to do. It's directly related to what you were trying to do, and better, but it's still a lucky find that you weren't looking for.
    - johnnyanmac 2y ago
      I don't know how related colon cancer is to general cancer treatment, but sure. If they end up making a general formula while researching a specific one, many people in the field would say they "stumled upon" gold. Even if they were looking for silver to begin with.
      - thaumasiotes 2y ago
        > I don't know how related colon cancer is to general cancer treatment Doesn't matter; that's not relevant to my point. When we attempt to find cancer treatments, we don't expect to find cures. (That's why we say "treatments"!) The goal of research into colon cancer is not to find a cure for colon cancer. It's to get the amount of remission that patients can expect to enjoy higher. Eliminating the cancer entirely is a completely different kind of result, and it would be the goal of a different kind of research.
hilsdev 2y ago
4chan has a large cesspit, but it gathers a lot of intelligent people who can ignore the noise. For any interest, there’s someone somewhere who made a half decent thread on the topic. There’s decent barriers too (as in the less talked about boards are more thoroughly moderated than the ones that make the news, much like Reddit)
- Der_Einzige 2y ago
  Shhh!!! Don't tell them that 4chan is the best origami/paper craft website on the internet!
  - jjmarr 2y ago
    one letter off from the alt-right!
  - TyPepakura3 2y ago
    They taught me how to model and how to transfer models to pepakura. It's really amazing how everything was just in place and you could ask a person something and have the answer by the next day. Reddit has shades of this, but it was never truly focused. The upvote system kills small discussions.
- rat9988 2y ago
  Most popular websites gather a lot of intelligent people. Nothing specific to 4chan.
  - johnnyanmac 2y ago
    4chan was very early, if not close to first of what we'd describe as a "forum" and persisted through the decades. That's the notable factor, outside of all the "noise" described above. But yes, the noise was also a part of the surprise factor here. Many people have this perception that intelligent people are dignified, studious,and fancy in their demeanor. So someone like that hanging out on an "anime forum" can be shocking to some.
ecshafer 2y ago
> Loath as I am to give 4chan credit for anything positive Why, whats wrong with 4chan? Outside of /pol/ and /b/ its just an image board with many different users.
- lukas099 2y ago
  Kinda with you, but outside of those two there is still a bias towards antisemitism and misogyny among other uncouth worldviews.
  - russelg 2y ago
    And those people are rightly called out as tourists, and told to go back to the hole they came from.
    - tstrimple 2y ago
      Yes, once I was naive enough to believe that all the 4chan regulars were just being ironic and it was just the uninformed visitors who took the degeneracy seriously. Unfortunately we all have to grow up at some point.
    - KennyBlanken 2y ago
      Ahem, you were bullshitting something? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boogaloo_movement https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boogaloo_movement ...also, a huge number of mass shooters have been 4chan regulars...
- TyPepakura3 2y ago
  And /v/. Basically, if it would attract a child, it does, and you stay away. The issue is it's not a fun website. The creative spark is gone.
- KennyBlanken 2y ago
  Not even close. A long time ago I spent a decent amount of time on 4chan and left because of the incessant bigotry, which was pervasive.
onetimeusename 2y ago
This story resurfaces every few years but the original post was on the /sci/ board in 2011. That was a loooooong time ago and although no one back then would have said 4chan was good (it was never good), it also doesn't surprise me it was originally posted there at that time. I don't think it would happen now.
- johnnyanmac 2y ago
  4chan was great, but it very much was one of the oldest proprietors of the so called "normie filter". The biggest most offensive boards caused 95% of the trouble the site is known for. the smaller boards and threads could get some interesting stories and content (of all were of course, of reasonable falseness and potential homosexuality). The vibe was fine as long as you avoided the modern attitude and approach everything with hostility. Unlike say, modern twitter, everyone in 4chan was in agreement that they were full of shit. It was never trying to be this platform of serious debate. Understanding that ironically enough frees you of a lot of inhibitions. ---- All the "elites" were definitely gone by the middle of the 2010's, though. Probably to less controversial and more popular platforms. It's nearly impossible to replicate this nowadays.
  - anal_reactor 2y ago
    4chan became the normie
  - somenameforme 2y ago
    There's something great about enforced anonymity. It gets rid of people saying what they think they should say, and instead simply what they think. It reminds one of the wisdom of the masses experiments. If you take a bunch of people and ask them how many peas are in a jar, the average will come out extremely close to the right answer. But if you let those people collaborate, debate, and try to pick the smartest answer - it tends to be far less accurate. It's part of the reason that I think decentralize everything is the way to go. You'll never reach the utopic highs that a perfect centralization might offer, but you'll also never reach the dystopic lows that a flawed centralization can impose.
finnthehuman 2y ago
>Loath as I am to give 4chan credit for anything positive I love the fact we have somewhere unambiguously lowbrow on the internet. It's fun to watch how highbrow places talk about it.
- mjr00 2y ago
  As the saying goes, most social media is stupid people pretending to be smart; 4chan is smart people pretending to be stupid.
  - lukas099 2y ago
    I wouldn't say 4chan's smarter than other social media. I'd say "stupid people not pretending".
    - fastball 2y ago
      The median user definitely seems smarter on 4chan (at least that is how it felt 10-20 years ago).
      - tstrimple 2y ago
        I think median is the wrong term here. There are some absolute freak geniuses on 4chan, but it's not the norm. It's the exception. The median is just as fucking stupid as they present themselves to be.
- make3 2y ago
  does it still exist? this is an old story
  - WJW 2y ago
    You can literally type in the url mate. Just go and check for yourself instead of having to ask HN.
bruhWithDeth 2y ago
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deleted 2y ago
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asddubs 2y ago

i took it to mean that they stumbled upon it in the sense that they didn't try to make a novel contribution to the field of mathematics or think they were doing that, but just solving a specific problem

AdmiralAsshat 2y ago
I suppose in my head, when the phrase "stumbled upon" is used, it would imply that someone was solving a problem that they weren't intending to solve, or via a method that they weren't intending. A hypothetical headline might be "Food scientist stumbles upon cure for cancer while refining process for fish oil": the scientist wasn't trying to solve the problem of cancer, they were trying to solve the problem of extending fish oil shelf-life, and incidentally found the former. But you would find it strange if the article said, "Oncologist stumbles upon cure for cancer while testing new colon cancer treatment." Because in that case, the scientist is seemingly doing what he set out to do--it was not unintentional. It seems like the 4chan poster knew enough about mathematics to recognize the stated problem as a mathematical problem and write a proof for it. That already demonstrates a degree of specialty and intention that makes "stumble upon" seem dismissive, to me. The fact that they didn't know they were solving a a more general, already-known problem is irrelevant, IMO. It would almost be like denying them credit because they didn't fill out the paperwork correctly.
- Arnavion 2y ago
  "Stumbled upon" is used for mathematicians discovering something by working it out all the time.
- thaumasiotes 2y ago
  > But you would find it strange if the article said, "Oncologist stumbles upon cure for cancer while testing new colon cancer treatment." Because in that case, the scientist is seemingly doing what he set out to do--it was not unintentional. I wouldn't really find that strange. Finding a cure for cancer is not an expected outcome of testing a cancer treatment and certainly isn't what the oncologist is trying to do. It's directly related to what you were trying to do, and better, but it's still a lucky find that you weren't looking for.
  - johnnyanmac 2y ago
    I don't know how related colon cancer is to general cancer treatment, but sure. If they end up making a general formula while researching a specific one, many people in the field would say they "stumled upon" gold. Even if they were looking for silver to begin with.
    - thaumasiotes 2y ago
      > I don't know how related colon cancer is to general cancer treatment Doesn't matter; that's not relevant to my point. When we attempt to find cancer treatments, we don't expect to find cures. (That's why we say "treatments"!) The goal of research into colon cancer is not to find a cure for colon cancer. It's to get the amount of remission that patients can expect to enjoy higher. Eliminating the cancer entirely is a completely different kind of result, and it would be the goal of a different kind of research.

hilsdev 2y ago

4chan has a large cesspit, but it gathers a lot of intelligent people who can ignore the noise. For any interest, there’s someone somewhere who made a half decent thread on the topic. There’s decent barriers too (as in the less talked about boards are more thoroughly moderated than the ones that make the news, much like Reddit)

Der_Einzige 2y ago
Shhh!!! Don't tell them that 4chan is the best origami/paper craft website on the internet!
- jjmarr 2y ago
  one letter off from the alt-right!
- TyPepakura3 2y ago
  They taught me how to model and how to transfer models to pepakura. It's really amazing how everything was just in place and you could ask a person something and have the answer by the next day. Reddit has shades of this, but it was never truly focused. The upvote system kills small discussions.
rat9988 2y ago
Most popular websites gather a lot of intelligent people. Nothing specific to 4chan.
- johnnyanmac 2y ago
  4chan was very early, if not close to first of what we'd describe as a "forum" and persisted through the decades. That's the notable factor, outside of all the "noise" described above. But yes, the noise was also a part of the surprise factor here. Many people have this perception that intelligent people are dignified, studious,and fancy in their demeanor. So someone like that hanging out on an "anime forum" can be shocking to some.

ecshafer 2y ago

> Loath as I am to give 4chan credit for anything positive Why, whats wrong with 4chan? Outside of /pol/ and /b/ its just an image board with many different users.

lukas099 2y ago
Kinda with you, but outside of those two there is still a bias towards antisemitism and misogyny among other uncouth worldviews.
- russelg 2y ago
  And those people are rightly called out as tourists, and told to go back to the hole they came from.
  - tstrimple 2y ago
    Yes, once I was naive enough to believe that all the 4chan regulars were just being ironic and it was just the uninformed visitors who took the degeneracy seriously. Unfortunately we all have to grow up at some point.
  - KennyBlanken 2y ago
    Ahem, you were bullshitting something? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boogaloo_movement https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boogaloo_movement ...also, a huge number of mass shooters have been 4chan regulars...
TyPepakura3 2y ago
And /v/. Basically, if it would attract a child, it does, and you stay away. The issue is it's not a fun website. The creative spark is gone.
KennyBlanken 2y ago
Not even close. A long time ago I spent a decent amount of time on 4chan and left because of the incessant bigotry, which was pervasive.

onetimeusename 2y ago

This story resurfaces every few years but the original post was on the /sci/ board in 2011. That was a loooooong time ago and although no one back then would have said 4chan was good (it was never good), it also doesn't surprise me it was originally posted there at that time. I don't think it would happen now.

johnnyanmac 2y ago
4chan was great, but it very much was one of the oldest proprietors of the so called "normie filter". The biggest most offensive boards caused 95% of the trouble the site is known for. the smaller boards and threads could get some interesting stories and content (of all were of course, of reasonable falseness and potential homosexuality). The vibe was fine as long as you avoided the modern attitude and approach everything with hostility. Unlike say, modern twitter, everyone in 4chan was in agreement that they were full of shit. It was never trying to be this platform of serious debate. Understanding that ironically enough frees you of a lot of inhibitions. ---- All the "elites" were definitely gone by the middle of the 2010's, though. Probably to less controversial and more popular platforms. It's nearly impossible to replicate this nowadays.
- anal_reactor 2y ago
  4chan became the normie
- somenameforme 2y ago
  There's something great about enforced anonymity. It gets rid of people saying what they think they should say, and instead simply what they think. It reminds one of the wisdom of the masses experiments. If you take a bunch of people and ask them how many peas are in a jar, the average will come out extremely close to the right answer. But if you let those people collaborate, debate, and try to pick the smartest answer - it tends to be far less accurate. It's part of the reason that I think decentralize everything is the way to go. You'll never reach the utopic highs that a perfect centralization might offer, but you'll also never reach the dystopic lows that a flawed centralization can impose.

finnthehuman 2y ago

>Loath as I am to give 4chan credit for anything positive I love the fact we have somewhere unambiguously lowbrow on the internet. It's fun to watch how highbrow places talk about it.

mjr00 2y ago
As the saying goes, most social media is stupid people pretending to be smart; 4chan is smart people pretending to be stupid.
- lukas099 2y ago
  I wouldn't say 4chan's smarter than other social media. I'd say "stupid people not pretending".
  - fastball 2y ago
    The median user definitely seems smarter on 4chan (at least that is how it felt 10-20 years ago).
    - tstrimple 2y ago
      I think median is the wrong term here. There are some absolute freak geniuses on 4chan, but it's not the norm. It's the exception. The median is just as fucking stupid as they present themselves to be.
make3 2y ago
does it still exist? this is an old story
- WJW 2y ago
  You can literally type in the url mate. Just go and check for yourself instead of having to ask HN.

bruhWithDeth 2y ago

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deleted 2y ago

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