3 ms·

Yeah, but at least buses and trains are accountable to the voter in one way or another... and I can still wear headphones.

gruez 2y ago
You can vote with your wallet and buy a car that doesn't have ads. The best you can do with ads on buses and trains is show up in your next city council meeting and raise a stink, only to be told that the transit agency signed a 10 year contract and can't pull out.
- ziddoap 2y ago
  This assumes that no other manufacturer will put ads in their cars. Hopefully that's the case! I think the concern is that once/if a critical mass of manufacturers include in-car ads, the rest can follow (because people still need vehicles in most areas), and the consumer has no more choice.
  - gruez 2y ago
    Is there any reason to believe they won't have a higher ad-free tier instead? If they get $500 LTV from showing ads, why wouldn't they offer a $1000 ad-free subscription? Seems to work fine with streaming platforms, for instance.
    - ziddoap 2y ago
      >Is there any reason to believe they won't have a higher ad-free tier instead? I mean, this is still awful, right? Subscriptions for the car I spent tens of thousands of dollars on? >Seems to work fine with streaming platforms, for instance. It's awful here, too, in my opinion. But tolerable because I didn't spend multiple years paying to own the product.
      - gruez 2y ago
        >I mean, this is still awful, right? Subscriptions for the car I spent tens of thousands of dollars on? Alternatively framed: $1000/year discount for opting into ads.
        ziddoap 2y ago
        The difference being that my previous car lasted near 15 years, and it was paid off in 7. Why would you want to pay a yearly fee after you're supposed to own the car, free and clear? I'll save us the back and forth: there is no model you can present (or reframing of a model) that will make me think advertisements (or an everlasting subscription to remove advertisements) in the car that I own is okay. It's profoundly depressing that I have to write it out that explicitly.
- sumeno 2y ago
  > You can vote with your wallet and buy a car that doesn't have ads. For now. I've yet to see an advertisement on a bus or train that wasn't easily ignorable. It's a lot harder to ignore things when you're driving
- alistairSH 2y ago
  Did the owners know they would be served ads when they purchased the car? That’s not clear to me.
  - gruez 2y ago
    Unless you go to every transit board meeting, you probably won't know that your local bus is going to have digital ad displays plastered on them either. Even then, such issues rarely come up as a ballot initiative so the most you can do is make an impassioned speech and hope they reverse course. So both cases are pretty similar, actually. You're choosing something (car brand/politician), vaguely hoping they serve your interests, and hope that the threat if you switching to competitors is enough to keep them in line.
    - alistairSH 2y ago
      Uh, buses have had ads on the sides forever, at least in the US. Buying a car, which haven’t had ads previously, only to discover after the fact that it serves ads is a change to the status quo. Even more so if the ads were pushed via firmware update and not something that was originally spec’ed (no clue if this is what happened, but sounds plausible, given lack of details).
      - gruez 2y ago
        >Uh, buses have had ads on the sides forever, at least in the US. That's why I mentioned "digital ad displays" specifically, because as other commenters have noted, are starting to pop up in some places.

gruez 2y ago

You can vote with your wallet and buy a car that doesn't have ads. The best you can do with ads on buses and trains is show up in your next city council meeting and raise a stink, only to be told that the transit agency signed a 10 year contract and can't pull out.

ziddoap 2y ago
This assumes that no other manufacturer will put ads in their cars. Hopefully that's the case! I think the concern is that once/if a critical mass of manufacturers include in-car ads, the rest can follow (because people still need vehicles in most areas), and the consumer has no more choice.
- gruez 2y ago
  Is there any reason to believe they won't have a higher ad-free tier instead? If they get $500 LTV from showing ads, why wouldn't they offer a $1000 ad-free subscription? Seems to work fine with streaming platforms, for instance.
  - ziddoap 2y ago
    >Is there any reason to believe they won't have a higher ad-free tier instead? I mean, this is still awful, right? Subscriptions for the car I spent tens of thousands of dollars on? >Seems to work fine with streaming platforms, for instance. It's awful here, too, in my opinion. But tolerable because I didn't spend multiple years paying to own the product.
    - gruez 2y ago
      >I mean, this is still awful, right? Subscriptions for the car I spent tens of thousands of dollars on? Alternatively framed: $1000/year discount for opting into ads.
      - ziddoap 2y ago
        The difference being that my previous car lasted near 15 years, and it was paid off in 7. Why would you want to pay a yearly fee after you're supposed to own the car, free and clear? I'll save us the back and forth: there is no model you can present (or reframing of a model) that will make me think advertisements (or an everlasting subscription to remove advertisements) in the car that I own is okay. It's profoundly depressing that I have to write it out that explicitly.
sumeno 2y ago
> You can vote with your wallet and buy a car that doesn't have ads. For now. I've yet to see an advertisement on a bus or train that wasn't easily ignorable. It's a lot harder to ignore things when you're driving
alistairSH 2y ago
Did the owners know they would be served ads when they purchased the car? That’s not clear to me.
- gruez 2y ago
  Unless you go to every transit board meeting, you probably won't know that your local bus is going to have digital ad displays plastered on them either. Even then, such issues rarely come up as a ballot initiative so the most you can do is make an impassioned speech and hope they reverse course. So both cases are pretty similar, actually. You're choosing something (car brand/politician), vaguely hoping they serve your interests, and hope that the threat if you switching to competitors is enough to keep them in line.
  - alistairSH 2y ago
    Uh, buses have had ads on the sides forever, at least in the US. Buying a car, which haven’t had ads previously, only to discover after the fact that it serves ads is a change to the status quo. Even more so if the ads were pushed via firmware update and not something that was originally spec’ed (no clue if this is what happened, but sounds plausible, given lack of details).
    - gruez 2y ago
      >Uh, buses have had ads on the sides forever, at least in the US. That's why I mentioned "digital ad displays" specifically, because as other commenters have noted, are starting to pop up in some places.