3 ms·

...and before you know it the old rivalries flare up again on who is to be the leader of this fourth iteration of a European empire. Germany versus France, Fran

...and before you know it the old rivalries flare up again on who is to be the leader of this fourth iteration of a European empire. Germany versus France, France versus the UK, Germany versus Poland, Italy versus France, a combination of some of these versus one of the others. A 'European army' would be under the control of... the EU? Some new organisation to be specifically created for this purpose? Some committee-designed scheme of rotating leadership between the main powers in Europe? These are not spurious questions. Europe is a large and diverse place, far more diverse than e.g. the USA. Would such an army serve to protect Hungary as well as Spain, Sweden as well as the Czech republic, Poland as well as Germany? Even if some of those countries do not care to fall in line with the agenda set by the Eurocrats in Brussels?

_fizz_buzz_ 2y ago
Not as long as there is an adversary I.e. the new US-Russia alliance.
watwut 2y ago
Hungary and Slovakia are pro-russia currently, so not really. But nothing unites people as much as common threat and both US and Russia are currently providing that.
robwwilliams 2y ago
Not much more diverse than the US. Yes, a melting pot, but Europe is now a big melting pot too. The most important axes is City versus rural communities which boils down to rich vs poor. And the USA and Europe are very similar in this way.
- Earw0rm 2y ago
  I can't speak for the US, but in Europe it's less rich/poor (though some country folk would like you to think so), and more rural conservative values vs city progressive values (which weirdly harbour some very religious-conservative people from immigrant/minority communities).
bad_user 2y ago
You can ask these questions about NATO as well, and while USA has been the greatest contributor, in a confrontation with China, it wouldn't stand a chance without its NATO allies. I know that many like to complain of Europe's bureaucracy, but we're talking about half a billion educated people, with enough resources and with an existential crisis, which we're surely facing, the EU+UK, joined by allies, can be a force to be reckoned with. The problems EU is facing come from within. We have far right movements as well, aided by propaganda, the pandemic and the immigration waves. The far right are more contained than in the US apparently (due to US having just 2 parties), but it can lead to government paralysis. Seeing the US administration ally itself with Russia to dismember the EU wasn't in my cards. So, it's going to be an interesting year.
Exoristos 2y ago
I think it's realistically only Germany v. France, with U.K. meddling (powerfully) from the sidelines. And I don't think either Germany or France has the fortitude to establish any real hegemony. So I predict that, with or without expressed U.S. support, Europe will continue to be satellites in the U.S. orbit.

_fizz_buzz_ 2y ago

Not as long as there is an adversary I.e. the new US-Russia alliance.

watwut 2y ago

Hungary and Slovakia are pro-russia currently, so not really. But nothing unites people as much as common threat and both US and Russia are currently providing that.

robwwilliams 2y ago

Not much more diverse than the US. Yes, a melting pot, but Europe is now a big melting pot too. The most important axes is City versus rural communities which boils down to rich vs poor. And the USA and Europe are very similar in this way.

Earw0rm 2y ago
I can't speak for the US, but in Europe it's less rich/poor (though some country folk would like you to think so), and more rural conservative values vs city progressive values (which weirdly harbour some very religious-conservative people from immigrant/minority communities).

bad_user 2y ago

You can ask these questions about NATO as well, and while USA has been the greatest contributor, in a confrontation with China, it wouldn't stand a chance without its NATO allies. I know that many like to complain of Europe's bureaucracy, but we're talking about half a billion educated people, with enough resources and with an existential crisis, which we're surely facing, the EU+UK, joined by allies, can be a force to be reckoned with. The problems EU is facing come from within. We have far right movements as well, aided by propaganda, the pandemic and the immigration waves. The far right are more contained than in the US apparently (due to US having just 2 parties), but it can lead to government paralysis. Seeing the US administration ally itself with Russia to dismember the EU wasn't in my cards. So, it's going to be an interesting year.

Exoristos 2y ago

I think it's realistically only Germany v. France, with U.K. meddling (powerfully) from the sidelines. And I don't think either Germany or France has the fortitude to establish any real hegemony. So I predict that, with or without expressed U.S. support, Europe will continue to be satellites in the U.S. orbit.