4 ms·

Really hoping human brain cells don't necessarily create consciousness, in this case.

ASalazarMX 2y ago
> hundreds of thousands of live human brain cells A human brain has like six orders of magnitude more cells than that chip. A single ant has 250,000 neurons. A crow brain has 1,500,000,000. I don't think we have to worry yet.
- odyssey7 2y ago
  Imagine that every individual cell is conscious, and that consciousness is a binary quality.
  - ASalazarMX 2y ago
    Imagine that it isn't. What use is imagining something without the slightest shred of evidence?
    - odyssey7 2y ago
      Panpsychism in various forms has historically held sway with many philosophers. It’s really the Occam’s razor for consciousness.
  - MattPalmer1086 2y ago
    Ok. So the brain cell is individually conscious. Won't be conscious of much, it has no sense organs. Just lost in its own thoughts?
    - namaria 2y ago
      That's pretty much how it felt when I experienced an ego death on mushrooms. My sense of self shattered and I could feel that I was emerging from a deep resonance in the consciousness of my cells.
    - odyssey7 2y ago
      Perhaps nerve endings within "sense organs" offer a level of abstraction in propagating information to a consciousness somewhere else. Consider happiness. Possibly a cell feels happy when there's plenty of energy and its cellular processes are working well. Possibly it feels something else leading up to apoptosis.
- chrsig 2y ago
  someone doesn't remember y2k.
- etrautmann 2y ago
  But how would you know? With a patient who has locked-in syndrome they can sense and think but have no ability to move or communicate. How could you tell if your fish brain (or future AI model) has the capacity to think or suffer?
  - h0l0cube 2y ago
    To answer the rhetorical: We don't know (and possibly can't know). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hard_problem_of_consciousness https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hard_problem_of_consciousness
  - addicted 2y ago
    You’re worried about a “brain” that has orders of magnitude fewer neurons than an ant but in the meanwhile we birth, enslave, sexually abuse, torture and kill over 80 billion land animals that definitely have conscience, sentience and a capacity to suffer. I do appreciate the concern. It’s very valid but unfortunately pales relative to awful atrocities we humans are enacting everyday in the billions.
- tomkarho 2y ago
  Emphasis in "yet"

> hundreds of thousands of live human brain cells A human brain has like six orders of magnitude more cells than that chip. A single ant has 250,000 neurons. A crow brain has 1,500,000,000. I don't think we have to worry yet.

odyssey7 2y ago
Imagine that every individual cell is conscious, and that consciousness is a binary quality.
- ASalazarMX 2y ago
  Imagine that it isn't. What use is imagining something without the slightest shred of evidence?
  - odyssey7 2y ago
    Panpsychism in various forms has historically held sway with many philosophers. It’s really the Occam’s razor for consciousness.
- MattPalmer1086 2y ago
  Ok. So the brain cell is individually conscious. Won't be conscious of much, it has no sense organs. Just lost in its own thoughts?
  - namaria 2y ago
    That's pretty much how it felt when I experienced an ego death on mushrooms. My sense of self shattered and I could feel that I was emerging from a deep resonance in the consciousness of my cells.
  - odyssey7 2y ago
    Perhaps nerve endings within "sense organs" offer a level of abstraction in propagating information to a consciousness somewhere else. Consider happiness. Possibly a cell feels happy when there's plenty of energy and its cellular processes are working well. Possibly it feels something else leading up to apoptosis.
chrsig 2y ago
someone doesn't remember y2k.
etrautmann 2y ago
But how would you know? With a patient who has locked-in syndrome they can sense and think but have no ability to move or communicate. How could you tell if your fish brain (or future AI model) has the capacity to think or suffer?
- h0l0cube 2y ago
  To answer the rhetorical: We don't know (and possibly can't know). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hard_problem_of_consciousness https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hard_problem_of_consciousness
- addicted 2y ago
  You’re worried about a “brain” that has orders of magnitude fewer neurons than an ant but in the meanwhile we birth, enslave, sexually abuse, torture and kill over 80 billion land animals that definitely have conscience, sentience and a capacity to suffer. I do appreciate the concern. It’s very valid but unfortunately pales relative to awful atrocities we humans are enacting everyday in the billions.
tomkarho 2y ago
Emphasis in "yet"