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Don't overweight rare examples. This is basically the only one that I ever see brought up too because it was a fuck up. Plus it's not like there's any force to

by rtkwe 2y ago

Don't overweight rare examples. This is basically the only one that I ever see brought up too because it was a fuck up. Plus it's not like there's any force to offering it.

ben_w 2y ago
I fairly frequently encounter wildly incorrect statements made by public-facing roles. While this is the famous human-euthanasia-related headline example of "WTAF were they thinking?", I've got a few more of that ilk in various cases: • Doctors refusing abortions and the mother dying as a result, even though the law allowed abortion in such cases • The entire public discourse (shouting match) over the various covid vaccines, and of course the lockdowns — as HN has a broad audience, I should note that regardless of which group any reader of this message thinks was "right", both sides were very loudly convinced the other was risking lives, and that necessarily means that a lot of people were very loudly, very forcefully, wrong • The UK's DWP telling loads of people they were considered "fit for work" when they were gravely ill and died shortly after Outside of fatal cases, but still medical: • I've also noticed that almost every discussion where women share experiences of doctors, regardless of group size, there's women who report doctors ignoring evidence and these women having to solve their medical issues on their own • I've personally had a GP tell me something was impossible when it had actually happened — In my case, food ending up in nasal cavity, which was very easy for me to know had happened as the food exited about an hour later via a nostril, but the GP thought it was impossible • Unnecessary surgeries (and I don't mean purely cosmetic surgery) are a thing • Retained surgical instruments are a thing: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Retained_surgical_instruments https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Retained_surgical_instruments Between unfeeling bureaucracies and emotional but flawed humans, there's a lot of room for people to end up pressured into unwanted euthanasia. Figuring out how to minimise suffering given all that? Well, even without that it would be beyond me. But it does make it harder.
- rtkwe 2y ago
  My main point is that the MAID vs wheel chair ramp is basically the only example of that happening I've ever seen where someone with a minor ask was 'pushed' towards MAID instead. There's rare but recurring then there's 'we have one extreme example' in the case of the vet wheel chair ramp. > Doctors refusing abortions and the mother dying as a result, even though the law allowed abortion in such cases Depends on what law you're talking about in the US some have quite unclear provisions and doctors and hospitals are wary of stepping into unclear water and having to litigate exactly how in danger the life of the mother was at that exact moment.
  - ben_w 2y ago
    > Depends on what law you're talking about Multiple. Ireland was a case I knew had happened, precipitating liberalisation of the law. In the US stories, I couldn't immediately recall if the discussions I have seen were actual cases or hypotheticals.
    - rtkwe 2y ago
      There have been several cases in the US where the mother wasn't given miscarriage care due to their anti-abortion law not having a clear enough exception. Even where there are if the criteria are too tough the wait can damage the woman's future chances of successfully having a kid too. One example there's several more out there. https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2024/oct/30/texas-woman-death-abortion-ban-miscarriage https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2024/oct/30/texas-woman-...

by rtkwe 2y ago

Don't overweight rare examples. This is basically the only one that I ever see brought up too because it was a fuck up. Plus it's not like there's any force to offering it.

ben_w 2y ago

I fairly frequently encounter wildly incorrect statements made by public-facing roles. While this is the famous human-euthanasia-related headline example of "WTAF were they thinking?", I've got a few more of that ilk in various cases: • Doctors refusing abortions and the mother dying as a result, even though the law allowed abortion in such cases • The entire public discourse (shouting match) over the various covid vaccines, and of course the lockdowns — as HN has a broad audience, I should note that regardless of which group any reader of this message thinks was "right", both sides were very loudly convinced the other was risking lives, and that necessarily means that a lot of people were very loudly, very forcefully, wrong • The UK's DWP telling loads of people they were considered "fit for work" when they were gravely ill and died shortly after Outside of fatal cases, but still medical: • I've also noticed that almost every discussion where women share experiences of doctors, regardless of group size, there's women who report doctors ignoring evidence and these women having to solve their medical issues on their own • I've personally had a GP tell me something was impossible when it had actually happened — In my case, food ending up in nasal cavity, which was very easy for me to know had happened as the food exited about an hour later via a nostril, but the GP thought it was impossible • Unnecessary surgeries (and I don't mean purely cosmetic surgery) are a thing • Retained surgical instruments are a thing: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Retained_surgical_instruments https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Retained_surgical_instruments Between unfeeling bureaucracies and emotional but flawed humans, there's a lot of room for people to end up pressured into unwanted euthanasia. Figuring out how to minimise suffering given all that? Well, even without that it would be beyond me. But it does make it harder.

rtkwe 2y ago
My main point is that the MAID vs wheel chair ramp is basically the only example of that happening I've ever seen where someone with a minor ask was 'pushed' towards MAID instead. There's rare but recurring then there's 'we have one extreme example' in the case of the vet wheel chair ramp. > Doctors refusing abortions and the mother dying as a result, even though the law allowed abortion in such cases Depends on what law you're talking about in the US some have quite unclear provisions and doctors and hospitals are wary of stepping into unclear water and having to litigate exactly how in danger the life of the mother was at that exact moment.
- ben_w 2y ago
  > Depends on what law you're talking about Multiple. Ireland was a case I knew had happened, precipitating liberalisation of the law. In the US stories, I couldn't immediately recall if the discussions I have seen were actual cases or hypotheticals.
  - rtkwe 2y ago
    There have been several cases in the US where the mother wasn't given miscarriage care due to their anti-abortion law not having a clear enough exception. Even where there are if the criteria are too tough the wait can damage the woman's future chances of successfully having a kid too. One example there's several more out there. https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2024/oct/30/texas-woman-death-abortion-ban-miscarriage https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2024/oct/30/texas-woman-...