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Interesting that the CNN article makes no mention of how badly under-utilized government office spaces are. https://wolfstreet.com/2025/01/25/doge-seeks-to-sh

Interesting that the CNN article makes no mention of how badly under-utilized government office spaces are. https://wolfstreet.com/2025/01/25/doge-seeks-to-shed-vast-amounts-of-government-office-space-heres-how-much-the-government-leases-and-where-and-what-it-can-shed-during-trumps-term/ https://wolfstreet.com/2025/01/25/doge-seeks-to-shed-vast-am... “A recent report from Sen. Joni Ernst, a Republican from Iowa who chairs the Senate DOGE caucus, found that not one of the headquarters for any major agency or department in Washington is more than half full. GSA-owned buildings in Washington, D.C., average about a 12% occupancy rate. The government owns more than 7,500 vacant buildings across the country, and more than 2,200 that are partially empty.” DOGE is hamfisted in its execution but why are we spending massive amounts of money for office buildings while people work from home? I'm a fan of remote work and would prefer that we crash the Commercial Real Estate market by canceling leases rather that stuffing people back into cubicle farms, but I think the context of trying to kill two birds with one stone (improve building utilization and also identify who is actually doing work and not just fucking off) makes some sense.

zug_zug 2y ago
Well a few thoughts. I feel like your question is trying to excuse reckless disregard (at best) as mere incompetence. I don't think if you sum up all the value on all the leases of wasted buildings it would be a drop in the bucket against the psychological damage (e.g. distrust in the system) being caused by this administration. Like unless it's more than 1% of the national budget (i.e. > 67 billion a year) then it isn't worth the chaos. And a competent administration that wanted to end leases really shouldn't have started RTO, so let's try not to fabricate plausible deniability here.
- CapricornNoble 2y ago
  >I feel like your question is trying to excuse reckless disregard (at best) as mere incompetence. Ehh, sometimes I'm really not sure how many of the sloppy decisions that are made are malicious, and how many are incompetent. >Like unless it's more than 1% of the national budget (i.e. > 67 billion a year) then it isn't worth the chaos. For people like Musk, chaos is a feature not a bug. Shaking a lot of low-value-add employees and processes out of their comfort zones is the point. >And a competent administration that wanted to end leases really shouldn't have started RTO I think the Scheme of Maneuver is: Phase 1: Bring everyone into the otherwise-nearly-empty offices. Phase 2: Figure out who is dead weight. Fire them. Phase 3: Figure out what max occupancy should be after the fat has been cut from the workforce, and cut all unneeded office space. Phase 4: Maybe allow some limited WFH (I'm not holding my breath on this one).
AnimalMuppet 2y ago
> why are we spending massive amounts of money for office buildings while people work from home? Valid point. But if that's the problem, why don't we get rid of the buildings and save the money, rather than force people back to the office so we have to keep spending money on the buildings?
AzzieElbab 2y ago
Is anyone even remotely curious why do government offices with no desks exist?
- mexicocitinluez 2y ago
  Do you know what a lease is? I can explain if you need. This is like asking "Why does my car that I leased for 3 years still exist after 1?" Idk man.
  - AzzieElbab 2y ago
    I hope your leased car has a driver's seat and can be driven. Also, I hope you leased the car with your own money
    - mexicocitinluez 2y ago
      > hope your leased car has a driver's seat and can be driven Huh? And what does my own money have anything to do with this? The leases were bought and then they had to pay. Are you implying people knew Covid was going to hit when they got these leases? It's hard for me to understand why this is such a complex thing to grasp. Particularly since it's been a focal point in our lives for 4 straight years.
      - AzzieElbab 2y ago
        You are speaking with 100% certainty of the timelines. You don't know any details of these leases and are simply making assumptions. Even if your assumptions are correct, the pandemic officially ended 2 years ago.
        mexicocitinluez 2y ago
        > Even if your assumptions are correct, the pandemic officially ended 2 years ago. You think the effects of a pandemic that literally stopped the world for over an entire year just goes away with the last case? I knew I was arguing with children on this site. The pandemic pushed everyone home. The office buildings that were leased are no longer needed. And EVEN SO, you could make the argument that prematurely ending a lease when you weren't sure the biggest raging dipshit on this planet wouldn't get elected and force everyone back in (like he is doing right now) despite it being a really really dumb idea isn't that far-fetched. You idiots will go to the ends of the earth to defend the absolute shitshow that is Doge and have this unbelievable need to believe that the government is chalk full of poeple who couldn't be bothered to make sure they weren't spedning millions on useless shit. GFTO Read a book for christ's sake.
mexicocitinluez 2y ago
> I'm a fan of remote work and would prefer that we crash the Commercial Real Estate market by canceling leases rather that stuffing people back into cubicle farms, Do you have even the slightest bit of proof that wasn't already the case? How do you know this wasn't already in progress?
pseudalopex 2y ago
Your article said GSA pays $5.2 billion in annual rent to private-sector landlords. Fiscal year 2024 discretionary spending was $1.6 trillion. So we are discussing 0.33%. Commercial leases are 5 or 10 years commonly. Many of the leases began before 2020 probably. Owned real estate increases in value in high demand markets and is difficult to sell in low demand markets. Completion of work can be and is tracked remotely.

zug_zug 2y ago

Well a few thoughts. I feel like your question is trying to excuse reckless disregard (at best) as mere incompetence. I don't think if you sum up all the value on all the leases of wasted buildings it would be a drop in the bucket against the psychological damage (e.g. distrust in the system) being caused by this administration. Like unless it's more than 1% of the national budget (i.e. > 67 billion a year) then it isn't worth the chaos. And a competent administration that wanted to end leases really shouldn't have started RTO, so let's try not to fabricate plausible deniability here.

CapricornNoble 2y ago
>I feel like your question is trying to excuse reckless disregard (at best) as mere incompetence. Ehh, sometimes I'm really not sure how many of the sloppy decisions that are made are malicious, and how many are incompetent. >Like unless it's more than 1% of the national budget (i.e. > 67 billion a year) then it isn't worth the chaos. For people like Musk, chaos is a feature not a bug. Shaking a lot of low-value-add employees and processes out of their comfort zones is the point. >And a competent administration that wanted to end leases really shouldn't have started RTO I think the Scheme of Maneuver is: Phase 1: Bring everyone into the otherwise-nearly-empty offices. Phase 2: Figure out who is dead weight. Fire them. Phase 3: Figure out what max occupancy should be after the fat has been cut from the workforce, and cut all unneeded office space. Phase 4: Maybe allow some limited WFH (I'm not holding my breath on this one).

AnimalMuppet 2y ago

> why are we spending massive amounts of money for office buildings while people work from home? Valid point. But if that's the problem, why don't we get rid of the buildings and save the money, rather than force people back to the office so we have to keep spending money on the buildings?

AzzieElbab 2y ago

Is anyone even remotely curious why do government offices with no desks exist?

mexicocitinluez 2y ago
Do you know what a lease is? I can explain if you need. This is like asking "Why does my car that I leased for 3 years still exist after 1?" Idk man.
- AzzieElbab 2y ago
  I hope your leased car has a driver's seat and can be driven. Also, I hope you leased the car with your own money
  - mexicocitinluez 2y ago
    > hope your leased car has a driver's seat and can be driven Huh? And what does my own money have anything to do with this? The leases were bought and then they had to pay. Are you implying people knew Covid was going to hit when they got these leases? It's hard for me to understand why this is such a complex thing to grasp. Particularly since it's been a focal point in our lives for 4 straight years.
    - AzzieElbab 2y ago
      You are speaking with 100% certainty of the timelines. You don't know any details of these leases and are simply making assumptions. Even if your assumptions are correct, the pandemic officially ended 2 years ago.
      - mexicocitinluez 2y ago
        > Even if your assumptions are correct, the pandemic officially ended 2 years ago. You think the effects of a pandemic that literally stopped the world for over an entire year just goes away with the last case? I knew I was arguing with children on this site. The pandemic pushed everyone home. The office buildings that were leased are no longer needed. And EVEN SO, you could make the argument that prematurely ending a lease when you weren't sure the biggest raging dipshit on this planet wouldn't get elected and force everyone back in (like he is doing right now) despite it being a really really dumb idea isn't that far-fetched. You idiots will go to the ends of the earth to defend the absolute shitshow that is Doge and have this unbelievable need to believe that the government is chalk full of poeple who couldn't be bothered to make sure they weren't spedning millions on useless shit. GFTO Read a book for christ's sake.

mexicocitinluez 2y ago

> I'm a fan of remote work and would prefer that we crash the Commercial Real Estate market by canceling leases rather that stuffing people back into cubicle farms, Do you have even the slightest bit of proof that wasn't already the case? How do you know this wasn't already in progress?

pseudalopex 2y ago

Your article said GSA pays $5.2 billion in annual rent to private-sector landlords. Fiscal year 2024 discretionary spending was $1.6 trillion. So we are discussing 0.33%. Commercial leases are 5 or 10 years commonly. Many of the leases began before 2020 probably. Owned real estate increases in value in high demand markets and is difficult to sell in low demand markets. Completion of work can be and is tracked remotely.