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None of the individuals working for this agency could provide a list of 5 things they did the prior week, either. The subthread here was talking about waste gen

by dcow 2y ago

None of the individuals working for this agency could provide a list of 5 things they did the prior week, either. The subthread here was talking about waste generally I wasn’t intending to move any goalposts. Ignore fraud. I still think it’s unacceptable for government workers to be insubordinate or absent to the point where they can't provide a weekly standup update when asked. That’s inefficient waste in my book.

ceejayoz 2y ago
If someone entirely outside my chain of command demands I give them a status update, “no” is often an appropriate answer. It doesn’t mean I can’t. It means I shouldn’t.
- dcow 2y ago
  And now they’re facing the consequences (the existence of which clearly refutes your chain of command argument). Maybe they are virtuous. Maybe they got bad advice from leadership. Either way the chapter is finished and the outcome doesn't seem positive for the insubordinate individuals.
  - ceejayoz 2y ago
    That’s not evidence the system is supposed to work this way. That’s evidence that the system is breaking.
notahacker 2y ago
> None of the individuals working for this agency could provide a list of 5 things they did the prior week, either. Elsewhere you have claimed this is stated in the article, despite the fact it doesn't state it in the article[1]. It's also already pretty well established that Elon bragged on his platform about "deleting" 18F long before sending out these messages to them and the rest of the federal government. So now you're moving the goalposts again to pretend that Elon's long-established desire to "delete" 18F actually amounts to justified dismissal for "insubordination" If the best arguments you can muster for DOGE's actions are all in bad faith, perhaps DOGE is not doing a good job. [1]the article merely notes that they received a second demand for standup updates mere hours before they were advised their entire department had been shut down, which if anything suggests DOGE isn't very good at coordinating what it's doing and that replying to those emails is pointless because you'll get fired anyway It also links to an article which confirms that they were fired because 18F "as been identified as part of this phase of GSA’s Reduction in Force (RIF) as non-critical", not for "insubordination:

by dcow 2y ago

ceejayoz 2y ago

If someone entirely outside my chain of command demands I give them a status update, “no” is often an appropriate answer. It doesn’t mean I can’t. It means I shouldn’t.

dcow 2y ago
And now they’re facing the consequences (the existence of which clearly refutes your chain of command argument). Maybe they are virtuous. Maybe they got bad advice from leadership. Either way the chapter is finished and the outcome doesn't seem positive for the insubordinate individuals.
- ceejayoz 2y ago
  That’s not evidence the system is supposed to work this way. That’s evidence that the system is breaking.

notahacker 2y ago

> None of the individuals working for this agency could provide a list of 5 things they did the prior week, either. Elsewhere you have claimed this is stated in the article, despite the fact it doesn't state it in the article[1]. It's also already pretty well established that Elon bragged on his platform about "deleting" 18F long before sending out these messages to them and the rest of the federal government. So now you're moving the goalposts again to pretend that Elon's long-established desire to "delete" 18F actually amounts to justified dismissal for "insubordination" If the best arguments you can muster for DOGE's actions are all in bad faith, perhaps DOGE is not doing a good job. [1]the article merely notes that they received a second demand for standup updates mere hours before they were advised their entire department had been shut down, which if anything suggests DOGE isn't very good at coordinating what it's doing and that replying to those emails is pointless because you'll get fired anyway It also links to an article which confirms that they were fired because 18F "as been identified as part of this phase of GSA’s Reduction in Force (RIF) as non-critical", not for "insubordination: