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> For reference the USPS delivers over 100B, yes billion, parcels per year. This must be pieces of mail per year? To me "parcel" means more like a package. So

> For reference the USPS delivers over 100B, yes billion, parcels per year. This must be pieces of mail per year? To me "parcel" means more like a package. Some web searching confirms this and also says a little over half of that is marketing mail. 60B pieces of spam per year. And I don't know about you, but excluding marketing mail, I'd say about 90% of the remainder still goes directly in the bin for me. And even though I open probably less than 5% of what is sent to me, maybe less than 1%, STILL much of that could have been an email. I don't doubt the USPS provides a whole lot of value and I don't want them to go down to 1 day per week or anything. But that 100B number looks like it includes a whole lot of negative, zero, or low value items.

shermantanktop 2y ago
Is the USPS creating that junk mail? Or are they just delivering it? Put another way, if you kill the USPS, don’t you think that junk mail will still find a way to get to you?
- wat10000 2y ago
  It would become substantially more expensive and thus substantially less in volume. Which indirectly shows the efficiency and value of the USPS. The fact that they can get stuff to people so cheaply is something nobody else can replicate.
reaperducer 2y ago
that 100B number looks like it includes a whole lot of negative, zero, or low value items. Clearly not an American, or an adult, or he would have needed the mail for things like: - Receive unemployment tax statements from the state - Life insurance forms. Especially converting a group policy into an individual policy. - IRS notices - Utility company refunds - Receive insurance policy documents - Receive notice of security breach at hospital - Receive bills for unexpected services like ambulance and medical - Receive license plates - Receive vehicle registration - Auto and homeowners insurance policy documents - Receive checks for credits from utilities after you move - My company got a check for $95 million in the mail from the IRS - Reimbursement checks from insurance companies - Certain correspondence with the I.R.S. can only be done by letter. No phone calls. No online. - Get hurt at work? Paperwork from insurance and from the state comes in paper form, not TikTok.
- furyofantares 2y ago
  Does any of that mean we need to lie and pretend that there's 100B pieces of useful mail being delivered? Just because there's a lot of useful mail doesn't mean there's 100B of it. That number shouldn't pass anyone's sniff test.
  - reaperducer 2y ago
    Does any of that mean we need to lie and pretend that there's 100B pieces of useful mail being delivered? I haven't seen any indication that it's a lie. Please post a link to the proof. Is not a lie simply because it doesn't align with your political view. Note that what you consider junk mail, other people may find valuable. I know someone who digs those ValPack coupons.
    - furyofantares 2y ago
      It actually does align with my political view. Someone else posted some links in this thread already. But OK here: https://www.uspsoig.gov/sites/default/files/reports/2024-09/risc-wp-24-008.pdf https://www.uspsoig.gov/sites/default/files/reports/2024-09/...
  - creato 2y ago
    I don't know if it's correct or not, but it doesn't fail my sniff test. It's an average of ~1 piece of mail per person per day. Most people probably don't get more than one piece of useful mail per week, but there are also people conducting business through the mail that might send or receive far more than that.
  - collingreen 2y ago
    Does the postal service only have value to you if it delivers 100B pieces of "useful" mail a year, according to some metric of useful? Even if I somehow thought the same way there is no version of a plan where I trust someone in government (or not in government) to decide what mail has value to me. This seems like such a dead end take. Yes junk mail is crappy, just like lots of other worthwhile tradeoffs when designing massive scale policy.
layer8 2y ago
Yes this is mail: https://www.statista.com/statistics/320234/mail-volume-of-the-usps/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/320234/mail-volume-of-th... Parcels is 6-7B: https://www.pitneybowes.com/content/dam/pitneybowes/us/en/shipping-index/24-mktc-00946-parcel-shipping-index-web-graphics_900x500-carrier-volume.png/jcr:content/renditions/24-mktc-00946-parcel-shipping-index-web-graphics_900x500-carrier-volume.1440.webp https://www.pitneybowes.com/content/dam/pitneybowes/us/en/sh...
Glyptodon 2y ago
It's true that the average flat paper mail I get is probably trash, but the percent that isn't trash tends to be quite important, and when you add packages delivered to that, the number of days per week that "real" mail is delivered to our address has gone up over the last twenty years, not down. (Not saying that's normal, but lot of deliveries.)
samstave 2y ago
It would be lovely if you could have the USPS scan and send all physical mail electronically (as a paid Mail + Pro fee) --and have it piped directly to a GPT who reads all the mail, logs the data into Sqlite3 and then have summaries, reminders, due dates, amount, budget hits, as daily summaries from your GPT of choice.. And then you can block marketing mail thats sent to you, and the USPS can encrypt the images that are sent to you... But you still need to receive things that are physical (like credit cards) There used to be mail services that people could have their mail routed to... But yeah, we still need mail - but we need "Mail+Pro" Subscription - And now the "You have mail" guy can be replaced by AI...

shermantanktop 2y ago

Is the USPS creating that junk mail? Or are they just delivering it? Put another way, if you kill the USPS, don’t you think that junk mail will still find a way to get to you?

wat10000 2y ago
It would become substantially more expensive and thus substantially less in volume. Which indirectly shows the efficiency and value of the USPS. The fact that they can get stuff to people so cheaply is something nobody else can replicate.

reaperducer 2y ago

that 100B number looks like it includes a whole lot of negative, zero, or low value items. Clearly not an American, or an adult, or he would have needed the mail for things like: - Receive unemployment tax statements from the state - Life insurance forms. Especially converting a group policy into an individual policy. - IRS notices - Utility company refunds - Receive insurance policy documents - Receive notice of security breach at hospital - Receive bills for unexpected services like ambulance and medical - Receive license plates - Receive vehicle registration - Auto and homeowners insurance policy documents - Receive checks for credits from utilities after you move - My company got a check for $95 million in the mail from the IRS - Reimbursement checks from insurance companies - Certain correspondence with the I.R.S. can only be done by letter. No phone calls. No online. - Get hurt at work? Paperwork from insurance and from the state comes in paper form, not TikTok.

furyofantares 2y ago
Does any of that mean we need to lie and pretend that there's 100B pieces of useful mail being delivered? Just because there's a lot of useful mail doesn't mean there's 100B of it. That number shouldn't pass anyone's sniff test.
- reaperducer 2y ago
  Does any of that mean we need to lie and pretend that there's 100B pieces of useful mail being delivered? I haven't seen any indication that it's a lie. Please post a link to the proof. Is not a lie simply because it doesn't align with your political view. Note that what you consider junk mail, other people may find valuable. I know someone who digs those ValPack coupons.
  - furyofantares 2y ago
    It actually does align with my political view. Someone else posted some links in this thread already. But OK here: https://www.uspsoig.gov/sites/default/files/reports/2024-09/risc-wp-24-008.pdf https://www.uspsoig.gov/sites/default/files/reports/2024-09/...
- creato 2y ago
  I don't know if it's correct or not, but it doesn't fail my sniff test. It's an average of ~1 piece of mail per person per day. Most people probably don't get more than one piece of useful mail per week, but there are also people conducting business through the mail that might send or receive far more than that.
- collingreen 2y ago
  Does the postal service only have value to you if it delivers 100B pieces of "useful" mail a year, according to some metric of useful? Even if I somehow thought the same way there is no version of a plan where I trust someone in government (or not in government) to decide what mail has value to me. This seems like such a dead end take. Yes junk mail is crappy, just like lots of other worthwhile tradeoffs when designing massive scale policy.

layer8 2y ago

Yes this is mail: https://www.statista.com/statistics/320234/mail-volume-of-the-usps/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/320234/mail-volume-of-th... Parcels is 6-7B: https://www.pitneybowes.com/content/dam/pitneybowes/us/en/shipping-index/24-mktc-00946-parcel-shipping-index-web-graphics_900x500-carrier-volume.png/jcr:content/renditions/24-mktc-00946-parcel-shipping-index-web-graphics_900x500-carrier-volume.1440.webp https://www.pitneybowes.com/content/dam/pitneybowes/us/en/sh...

Glyptodon 2y ago

It's true that the average flat paper mail I get is probably trash, but the percent that isn't trash tends to be quite important, and when you add packages delivered to that, the number of days per week that "real" mail is delivered to our address has gone up over the last twenty years, not down. (Not saying that's normal, but lot of deliveries.)

samstave 2y ago

It would be lovely if you could have the USPS scan and send all physical mail electronically (as a paid Mail + Pro fee) --and have it piped directly to a GPT who reads all the mail, logs the data into Sqlite3 and then have summaries, reminders, due dates, amount, budget hits, as daily summaries from your GPT of choice.. And then you can block marketing mail thats sent to you, and the USPS can encrypt the images that are sent to you... But you still need to receive things that are physical (like credit cards) There used to be mail services that people could have their mail routed to... But yeah, we still need mail - but we need "Mail+Pro" Subscription - And now the "You have mail" guy can be replaced by AI...