4 ms·

Why should income from labor be taxed at all? Income taxes strike me as fundamentally wrong.

• digdugdirk 2y ago
  What is your preferred alternative to fund basic common services required for a modern society? And what are the pros/cons and outcomes of your preferred alternative?
  • _1tem 2y ago
    Do you know what happens to your income tax when you pay it to the government? They destroy it (if it's cash), or simplify nullify electronic values. The government literally prints money, it doesn't need your taxes to "make" money. Income taxes were invented before the creation of fiat (non-gold backed) currency. Lots of countries in the world operate without income taxes.
    • trial3 2y ago
      > Lots of countries in the world operate without income taxes. Okay, but "lots" feels untrue and saying "operate" is borderline deceptive - there are 21 that I can find from a random infographic [0]. Human rights superstars like the UAE, NK, Brunei, and Saudi Arabia; above-board corporate havens like the Cayman Islands; and places I can't come up with a quippy joke about like Monaco or Vatican City. I'm no geopolitics expert, but it looks like one thing that "functional sovereign states meaningfully participating in the world stage without oil money or some clear outside source of capital" all have in common is income taxes. [0] https://www.visualcapitalist.com/charted-a-handy-list-of-countries-with-no-income-taxes/ https://www.visualcapitalist.com/charted-a-handy-list-of-cou...
    • KolmogorovComp 2y ago
      > Lots of countries in the world operate without income taxes. Can you give some examples? Do you think you live better in those countries than those with taxes?
      • _1tem 2y ago
        Monaco is one of the nicest places on earth. Lots of wealthy people go there to retire or just live.
      • gabesullice 2y ago
        The government of Florida operates with no income tax. Its GDP is comparable to Spain and its population sits between Chile and Australia. Less than one fifth of its revenue comes from federal sources. If its residents weren't paying federal income taxes, Florida could probably afford to increase its taxes to cover the difference. In the US, local taxes—not federal taxes—pay for the majority of surface street maintenance, schools, emergency services, licensing regimes, health and safety inspections, unemployment insurance, etc. I.e., most of what one considers to be staples of the social contract in a well-administered society. It seems as though you're implying income taxes are a prerequisite to some standard of living comparable to the US, but that presupposes that income taxes in the US actually pay for the things that make a place worth living in. If all of those staples are paid for by local governments, then what do federal income taxes pay for? Retirees and military procurement, for the most part. Can you imagine other ways to raise those funds?
        • freddie_mercury 2y ago
          > Less than one fifth of its revenue comes from federal sources Over one-quarter (26%) comes from Federal sources according to the Census Bureau's Annual Survey of State and Local Government Finances. Having 26% of your government funded by (Federal) income taxes sure sounds like Florida can't operate without income taxes. They simply outsource collection to another jurisdiction.
          • gabesullice 2y ago
            Here is my source, which uses the same census data in your claim: https://usafacts.org/articles/which-states-rely-the-most-on-federal-aid/ https://usafacts.org/articles/which-states-rely-the-most-on-... Regardless, I addressed your point already.
          • 2y ago
  • meowkit 2y ago
    A Land Value Tax https://www.google.com/search?q=is%20land%20a%20big%20deal&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&client=firefox-b-1-m https://www.google.com/search?q=is%20land%20a%20big%20deal&i...
  • pulkitsh1234 2y ago
    just tax the bussiness's income, don't tax a human's income?
    • runeks 2y ago
      The income of a business comes, ultimately, from a consumer. So this essentially amounts to a tax on consumption (which I think is fine, to be clear).
• eli_gottlieb 2y ago
  Labor is a near-universal ingredient for economic activity. If you refuse to tax anything with a labor component, you run out of things to tax at all.
  • adammarples 2y ago
    Land value. Inheritance. Rental income. Dividend income. Capital gains. Sales. Resource extraction. Etc