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I'm traveling around the western US in my campervan for the last month going between various parks. Lesser known NP's aren't even checking people at the gate o

I'm traveling around the western US in my campervan for the last month going between various parks. Lesser known NP's aren't even checking people at the gate on the way in. I've been able to (leave no trace) boondock easily within the boundaries by finding side roads or even just staying the night in a dead end parking lot. Something I probably wouldn't have tried when it is more busy. If this is what it is like to see the park without staff, when warmer weather hits and the parks begin to really fill up, it is going to be a mess. Some of the parks seem to be under various forms of winter expansion and construction of campgrounds, I wonder how they will service the growth. Maybe this happens to be the perfect time right now to be doing this then. The irony for me is that this travel is only possible for me because of Starlink. Thanks Elon?

JumpCrisscross 2y ago
> wonder how they will service the growth They won’t. The next step will be illegal harvesting of resources from public lands going unpunished.
- latchkey 2y ago
  BLM is huge, remote and hard to regulate. Wouldn't that already be happening if it was easy to do at scale?
  - JumpCrisscross 2y ago
    BLM controls the shit land. The only people who want it are ranchers for grazing. Our Parks and Forests contain vast resource and cultural wealth.
    - latchkey 2y ago
      What I've found is that the parks I'm visiting are surrounded by BLM. There are tons of backroads that go in and out of the parks through BLM, without anyone watching the gates. Great places to boondock too.
      - slowmovintarget 2y ago
        What is the expansion of BLM? Bureau of Land Management?
        latchkey 2y ago
        Yes. https://www.blm.gov/ https://www.blm.gov/
mindslight 2y ago
> I've been able to (leave no trace) boondock easily within the boundaries by finding side roads or even just staying the night in a dead end parking lot. Just for reference, I tried this in various parks about ~15 years ago (before most parks were overwhelmed with people), and always got called out before I even had a chance to start sleeping.
- latchkey 2y ago
  I asked the ranger at the gate of one NP if there is a closing time for the park and he laughed and said the park is open 24 hours. One campground in the park was full on reserve'murica and nearly empty when I drove by it. Why drive out of the park to find BLM when I could just stay there in the park? So, I used google maps and found a little side road at the end of a trail parking lot, where you had to drive up a curb and through a gate (which was open)... drove down about a mile out of sight and parked. Most people are in big RV's and need hookups or sleep in tents, so they shouldn't do this. I'm totally off grid, LNT, and self-sufficient for weeks at a time. Not bothering anyone or over staying my time there. I actually wouldn't mind seeing more people do it this way. Yes, the stars are beyond amazing at night.
- mindslight 2y ago
  latchkey, I don't know why your reply is straight [dead]. You're just describing the apparent dynamic these days, to the extent it's indicative of overall decay that's not on you. Whenever I got called out by rangers, I would invariably be directed to a campsite. There was always room. Obviously before this reserve'murica dynamic that apparently makes campsites something like concert tickets or NYC restaurant tables. The times I would try to sleep rougher in my car was when I was coming from FS/BLM land where it's more of a free for all, I got in late, and wasn't planning on staying at the NP very long. Eventually I got used to the idea that the Parks have much more stringent rules and controls precisely because they are designated parks. You're not in some raw state of being in nature, but rather more like a highly-trafficked museum - they built roads and put a dot on the map attracting throngs of humans that need to be managed.
- latchkey 2y ago
  My and your reply got killed. Interesting moderation going on here @dang.
_DeadFred_ 2y ago
Can they partly work around this using drones? They should be able to at least monitor a larger range. Add a speaker to tell people to move out? I can say I wouldn't be willing to take my children to more remote areas at this point. If you do please bring QuikClot/Celox and the super glue type suture stuff. If you are visiting the upper Rocky Mountain West and doing anything mildly extreme this summer you might want to look into a life flight membership. https://www.lifeflight.org/membership/ https://www.lifeflight.org/membership/
- latchkey 2y ago
  They kind of nixed that themselves... (of course, rules are meant to be broken)... https://www.nps.gov/orgs/aviationprogram/upload/unmanned-aircraft-in-national-parks.pdf https://www.nps.gov/orgs/aviationprogram/upload/unmanned-air...

JumpCrisscross 2y ago

> wonder how they will service the growth They won’t. The next step will be illegal harvesting of resources from public lands going unpunished.

latchkey 2y ago
BLM is huge, remote and hard to regulate. Wouldn't that already be happening if it was easy to do at scale?
- JumpCrisscross 2y ago
  BLM controls the shit land. The only people who want it are ranchers for grazing. Our Parks and Forests contain vast resource and cultural wealth.
  - latchkey 2y ago
    What I've found is that the parks I'm visiting are surrounded by BLM. There are tons of backroads that go in and out of the parks through BLM, without anyone watching the gates. Great places to boondock too.
    - slowmovintarget 2y ago
      What is the expansion of BLM? Bureau of Land Management?
      - latchkey 2y ago
        Yes. https://www.blm.gov/ https://www.blm.gov/

mindslight 2y ago

> I've been able to (leave no trace) boondock easily within the boundaries by finding side roads or even just staying the night in a dead end parking lot. Just for reference, I tried this in various parks about ~15 years ago (before most parks were overwhelmed with people), and always got called out before I even had a chance to start sleeping.

latchkey 2y ago
I asked the ranger at the gate of one NP if there is a closing time for the park and he laughed and said the park is open 24 hours. One campground in the park was full on reserve'murica and nearly empty when I drove by it. Why drive out of the park to find BLM when I could just stay there in the park? So, I used google maps and found a little side road at the end of a trail parking lot, where you had to drive up a curb and through a gate (which was open)... drove down about a mile out of sight and parked. Most people are in big RV's and need hookups or sleep in tents, so they shouldn't do this. I'm totally off grid, LNT, and self-sufficient for weeks at a time. Not bothering anyone or over staying my time there. I actually wouldn't mind seeing more people do it this way. Yes, the stars are beyond amazing at night.
mindslight 2y ago
latchkey, I don't know why your reply is straight [dead]. You're just describing the apparent dynamic these days, to the extent it's indicative of overall decay that's not on you. Whenever I got called out by rangers, I would invariably be directed to a campsite. There was always room. Obviously before this reserve'murica dynamic that apparently makes campsites something like concert tickets or NYC restaurant tables. The times I would try to sleep rougher in my car was when I was coming from FS/BLM land where it's more of a free for all, I got in late, and wasn't planning on staying at the NP very long. Eventually I got used to the idea that the Parks have much more stringent rules and controls precisely because they are designated parks. You're not in some raw state of being in nature, but rather more like a highly-trafficked museum - they built roads and put a dot on the map attracting throngs of humans that need to be managed.
latchkey 2y ago
My and your reply got killed. Interesting moderation going on here @dang.

_DeadFred_ 2y ago

Can they partly work around this using drones? They should be able to at least monitor a larger range. Add a speaker to tell people to move out? I can say I wouldn't be willing to take my children to more remote areas at this point. If you do please bring QuikClot/Celox and the super glue type suture stuff. If you are visiting the upper Rocky Mountain West and doing anything mildly extreme this summer you might want to look into a life flight membership. https://www.lifeflight.org/membership/ https://www.lifeflight.org/membership/

latchkey 2y ago
They kind of nixed that themselves... (of course, rules are meant to be broken)... https://www.nps.gov/orgs/aviationprogram/upload/unmanned-aircraft-in-national-parks.pdf https://www.nps.gov/orgs/aviationprogram/upload/unmanned-air...