3 ms·

I’m having a really hard time believing you are serious. The one time I tried out azure for a few days the portal was absolutely painful. Every click would take

I’m having a really hard time believing you are serious. The one time I tried out azure for a few days the portal was absolutely painful. Every click would take 5-10 seconds for a response. Sometimes basic settings change actions would take 2+ minutes of watching an Ajax spinner. How can anyone enjoy working like that???

tsimionescu 2y ago
Sure, the UI is sluggish, but at least you don't have to move through three different "services" to find the routing table that your VM is using. AWS UIs are generally snappy and smartly designed individually, but they are horrendously organized at the general level. AWS is built as if you are exploring a relational DB containing your resources, instead of a deployment tree. Your VM doesn't have a NIC in AWS, it has a foreign key to your entire VPC's NIC table, which lives in the VPC service, not the EC2 service. And then your NIC doesn't have an associated subnet, it has a foreign key to the subnet. And then when you get to the subnet table, you look up the routing tables table, and finally in the routing tables table, you'll find the settings for the routing table. This all works through following links, but the constant context switching and tabs upon tabs that AWS UI requires are extremely unpleasant for me at least to use. I'll take Azure's sluggish UI that organizes all of this in one-two pages instead of four any day.
- zamalek 2y ago
  AWS pages are built by different teams, and it shows. We're all supposed to use IAC though, right? In all seriousness, even in the face of IAC, the one thing Azure can do that AWS can't [at the time this happened to me], is have a global view of everything that's running right now and costing me money. It was years back, it was a $5 bill, but the principle of it had me livid. I did my best to tear down everything after my evaluation, yet something was squirreled away costing money. So yeah, absolutely, sluggish UI all the way (I also find the Amazon storefront profoundly ugly and disorganized).
  - antonvs 2y ago
    For a view of everything that’s costing you money, you can just look at your detailed billing data. That’s been available for at least 13 years.
  - Hikikomori 2y ago
    You using terraform state to look at route table entries?
- Hikikomori 2y ago
  ENIs are under ec2 in the console, not VPC, on API/CLI they're all under ec2 together with all networking. If you click an instance and go to its networking tab you get a list of ENI IDs that are clickable links to the resource, same for vpc and subnet. If you click subnet you can just click the route table tab, so if you're on an instances networking tab the route table is 2 clicks away. But rather than doing this you could use reachability analyzer that allows you to check routing tables and security groups for a source and destination IP/resource and port on same or different VPCs connected with peering or TGW and it will tell you if you're missing routes or SG rules in either direction. I created a slackbot that allowed our devs to input src/dst IP/domain and port an that used this API to do the check for them, saved a lot of time troubleshooting. I had an absolutely horrendous time working in Azure a few years ago (as a network engineer), we did have quite a complex setup with custom route tables and Azure Firewall though and VPN connectivity between Azure and AWS, but stuff like their VPN gateway taking 40+ minutes to change instance size on, wtf? I've filed 2-3 bugs to AWS in the almost 10 years I've worked with it, all for newly created APIs/services, they were all fixed within a week or two. I filed 8+ bugs to Azure in the first month using them, none of them were fixed as they had workarounds instead. And their documentation is absolutely useless, I could never trust that I understood what I read correctly, I always had to verify that it worked that way by testing it.
solatic 2y ago
I think OP is trying to differentiate between Azure APIs, which are unbelievably slow and horrible, and the UI design itself - the layout, the font, how one screen will flow to another screen, what links to what, how it would be laid out in a tool like Figma. Azure's APIs are atrociously slow. Azure's UI design is pretty nice. There's not much the UI designers can do about their API colleagues.
blencdr 2y ago
God, you never tried Oracle Cloud. It's not an UI, it's an escape room. I would pay to switch to Azure.
Epa095 2y ago
And most links can't be opened in a new window, you ant right click on them and middle click don't work!!
- 7bit 2y ago
  My god, I've been sending feedback about this shit for 3 or so years. You can't open any-fucking-thing in a new tab. The funny thing is, it used to work and they fucked that up. I don't understand how dumb you must be to design a web site that way. It's like a brewery that sells their beer in plastic shopping bags and thinks that's good.
mexicocitinluez 2y ago
> I’m having a really hard time believing you are serious and > The one time I tried out azure for a few days the portal was absolutely painful. conflict with each other. Here's what you sound like: "I don't believe you because I have very little experience in something and it doesn't comport with that."
dustedcodes 2y ago
must be a paid troll, no self respecting intelligent engineer would find the Azure portal good. it’s horrible ux, really convoluted and complicated, very unintuitive, horizontal scroll is a joke when the web scrolls vertically, tiny fonts making everything hard to read and screens overloaded with so much shit and yet they managed to not put on the screen the main thing that developers would care about. it’s a complete joke
- tanseydavid 2y ago
  Major pain point in Azure -- Azure resources in the portal do NOT show: * WHEN the resource was created * nor WHO created the resource IMHO this is unforgiveable, but on second though, it is probably intentional rather than any sort of oversight.
  - jwnin 2y ago
    it is hit and miss nowadays. definitely better than it was, though. somethign that should be common engineering criteria, i agree.

tsimionescu 2y ago

Sure, the UI is sluggish, but at least you don't have to move through three different "services" to find the routing table that your VM is using. AWS UIs are generally snappy and smartly designed individually, but they are horrendously organized at the general level. AWS is built as if you are exploring a relational DB containing your resources, instead of a deployment tree. Your VM doesn't have a NIC in AWS, it has a foreign key to your entire VPC's NIC table, which lives in the VPC service, not the EC2 service. And then your NIC doesn't have an associated subnet, it has a foreign key to the subnet. And then when you get to the subnet table, you look up the routing tables table, and finally in the routing tables table, you'll find the settings for the routing table. This all works through following links, but the constant context switching and tabs upon tabs that AWS UI requires are extremely unpleasant for me at least to use. I'll take Azure's sluggish UI that organizes all of this in one-two pages instead of four any day.

zamalek 2y ago
AWS pages are built by different teams, and it shows. We're all supposed to use IAC though, right? In all seriousness, even in the face of IAC, the one thing Azure can do that AWS can't [at the time this happened to me], is have a global view of everything that's running right now and costing me money. It was years back, it was a $5 bill, but the principle of it had me livid. I did my best to tear down everything after my evaluation, yet something was squirreled away costing money. So yeah, absolutely, sluggish UI all the way (I also find the Amazon storefront profoundly ugly and disorganized).
- antonvs 2y ago
  For a view of everything that’s costing you money, you can just look at your detailed billing data. That’s been available for at least 13 years.
- Hikikomori 2y ago
  You using terraform state to look at route table entries?
Hikikomori 2y ago
ENIs are under ec2 in the console, not VPC, on API/CLI they're all under ec2 together with all networking. If you click an instance and go to its networking tab you get a list of ENI IDs that are clickable links to the resource, same for vpc and subnet. If you click subnet you can just click the route table tab, so if you're on an instances networking tab the route table is 2 clicks away. But rather than doing this you could use reachability analyzer that allows you to check routing tables and security groups for a source and destination IP/resource and port on same or different VPCs connected with peering or TGW and it will tell you if you're missing routes or SG rules in either direction. I created a slackbot that allowed our devs to input src/dst IP/domain and port an that used this API to do the check for them, saved a lot of time troubleshooting. I had an absolutely horrendous time working in Azure a few years ago (as a network engineer), we did have quite a complex setup with custom route tables and Azure Firewall though and VPN connectivity between Azure and AWS, but stuff like their VPN gateway taking 40+ minutes to change instance size on, wtf? I've filed 2-3 bugs to AWS in the almost 10 years I've worked with it, all for newly created APIs/services, they were all fixed within a week or two. I filed 8+ bugs to Azure in the first month using them, none of them were fixed as they had workarounds instead. And their documentation is absolutely useless, I could never trust that I understood what I read correctly, I always had to verify that it worked that way by testing it.

solatic 2y ago

I think OP is trying to differentiate between Azure APIs, which are unbelievably slow and horrible, and the UI design itself - the layout, the font, how one screen will flow to another screen, what links to what, how it would be laid out in a tool like Figma. Azure's APIs are atrociously slow. Azure's UI design is pretty nice. There's not much the UI designers can do about their API colleagues.

blencdr 2y ago

God, you never tried Oracle Cloud. It's not an UI, it's an escape room. I would pay to switch to Azure.

Epa095 2y ago

And most links can't be opened in a new window, you ant right click on them and middle click don't work!!

7bit 2y ago
My god, I've been sending feedback about this shit for 3 or so years. You can't open any-fucking-thing in a new tab. The funny thing is, it used to work and they fucked that up. I don't understand how dumb you must be to design a web site that way. It's like a brewery that sells their beer in plastic shopping bags and thinks that's good.

mexicocitinluez 2y ago

> I’m having a really hard time believing you are serious and > The one time I tried out azure for a few days the portal was absolutely painful. conflict with each other. Here's what you sound like: "I don't believe you because I have very little experience in something and it doesn't comport with that."

dustedcodes 2y ago

must be a paid troll, no self respecting intelligent engineer would find the Azure portal good. it’s horrible ux, really convoluted and complicated, very unintuitive, horizontal scroll is a joke when the web scrolls vertically, tiny fonts making everything hard to read and screens overloaded with so much shit and yet they managed to not put on the screen the main thing that developers would care about. it’s a complete joke

tanseydavid 2y ago
Major pain point in Azure -- Azure resources in the portal do NOT show: * WHEN the resource was created * nor WHO created the resource IMHO this is unforgiveable, but on second though, it is probably intentional rather than any sort of oversight.
- jwnin 2y ago
  it is hit and miss nowadays. definitely better than it was, though. somethign that should be common engineering criteria, i agree.