12 ms·

Ha, I worked on that project. That drove a lot of good requirements into Windows that set us up for web based services (eventually)

DaiPlusPlus 2y ago
> Windows that set us up for web based services (eventually) ...and then .NET and SQL Server started shipping for Linux.
- chupasaurus 2y ago
  There are 2 decades between those 2 points, .NET was -4 y.o. at the first one.
- tharkun__ 2y ago
  SQL Server is really Sybase tho, which was always capable of running on UNIX. Can't say much more, but I worked on a huge (internal) Sybase ASE on Linux based app (you've _all_ bought products administered on this app ;) ) way back (yes, pre-SSD, multi path fiber I/O to get things fast, failover etc.) and T-SQL is really nice, as is/was ASE and the replication server. Been about 20 years tho, so who knows.
  - icedchai 2y ago
    I used to work at a Sybase shop in the late 90's. It was way nicer to work with than Oracle!
  - p_ing 2y ago
    SQL Server uses NT and Win32 APIs, so the SQL team built a platform independent layer. Meaning NT and Win32 is still used by SQL on Linux. It’s pretty cool tech. https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/sql-server/blog/2016/12/16/sql-server-on-linux-how-introduction/ https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/sql-server/blog/2016/12/16/s...
  - pimeys 2y ago
    I worked with SQL Server a bit, writing a Rust client for it back in the days. The manual is really good, explaining the protocol clearly. That made it really easy to write a client for it. Can't say the same for Oracle...
  - pjmlp 2y ago
    Only if you are speaking about SQL Server 7 and earlier, meaning around 2002. Microsoft SQL Server has long stop being Sybase SQL Server, and works on Linux by making use of Drawbridge. https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/sql-server/blog/2016/12/16/sql-server-on-linux-how-introduction/ https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/sql-server/blog/2016/12/16/s...
    - tharkun__ 2y ago
      Of course, that's fair. I guess wording wise for my comment, the "Hah, they didn't actually write that themselves, they just bought the Sybase rights to everything license" got the better of me :) To be fair again, from what I hear, SQL server at Microsoft did some nice things on top of Sybase but the base, T-SQL, is just nice overall and by itself. I really want to like Postgres (and I do) but some of the awesome things I had with actual Sybase ASE 20+ years ago, Postgres still does not have. And that was a piece of software that had those features I loved for 10+ years prior to when I started working with it. The app we're talking of here was 15 years old when I worked on it 20+ years ago and it's probably still around and very probably still uses Sybase ASE (tho the actual app was converted from Smalltalk to Java ;) I also later on had to use Oracle and had the same "WTF? You can't do that?" experience :shrug:
p_ing 2y ago
Are you free to expand upon your role and perhaps some of the actual tech/fixes that made it back into Windows?
Thaxll 2y ago
Like IIS running some part of the code in the kernel? ( http.sys ) :x
- p_ing 2y ago
  It has its advantages… but wasn’t done until Svr 2003. https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/iis/get-started/introduction-to-iis/introduction-to-iis-architecture#hypertext-transfer-protocol-stack-httpsys https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/iis/get-started/introducti...
  - hulitu 2y ago
    > It has its advantages Yeah, the advantages (RCE) were copied by modern web browsers. /s
slt2021 2y ago
Seriously, Windows 2000 was one of the most stable OS back in the day, rock solid. I used 2000 server as a desktop OS, instead of 98. unlike shit show that was windows 95/98/ME
- smackeyacky 2y ago
  Windows 2000 server was peak windows. All the subsequent versions just got harder to maintain as they gradually ruined the user interface. Nobody cares about the UI on consumer windows but if you’re spending a lot of time in RDP the vista based server products are terrible. I don’t hate windows 2019 but Linux is better, easier, faster and a relief after any futile attempts to use IIS or sql server in 2025.
  - aloha2436 2y ago
    > vista based server products are terrible. The first generation of tabletised 8/Metro interfaces made me audibly groan every time I had to RDP into machines running 2012.
    - smackeyacky 2y ago
      Oh yes. I still have a client that has 2012 and it physically hurts to use
    - 9dev 2y ago
      The stuttering over RDP when the start menu animation tried to slide in the tiles was amazing.
  - genewitch 2y ago
    windows xp x64 edition was pretty slick; and so was NT4. I agree that 2000 was pretty cool, but perhaps a lot of that is design nostalgia. It was very "serious business OS" where XP and Me looked like jellybeans and cartoons. My favorite windows, though, is win 7 ultimate, Steve Ballmer Edition. i was sad when i had to upgrade to winten. ninja proof: https://i.imgur.com/l29rDVo.jpeg https://i.imgur.com/l29rDVo.jpeg
UltraSane 2y ago
So it is one of the most successful examples of dogfooding in history?

DaiPlusPlus 2y ago

> Windows that set us up for web based services (eventually) ...and then .NET and SQL Server started shipping for Linux.

chupasaurus 2y ago
There are 2 decades between those 2 points, .NET was -4 y.o. at the first one.
tharkun__ 2y ago
SQL Server is really Sybase tho, which was always capable of running on UNIX. Can't say much more, but I worked on a huge (internal) Sybase ASE on Linux based app (you've _all_ bought products administered on this app ;) ) way back (yes, pre-SSD, multi path fiber I/O to get things fast, failover etc.) and T-SQL is really nice, as is/was ASE and the replication server. Been about 20 years tho, so who knows.
- icedchai 2y ago
  I used to work at a Sybase shop in the late 90's. It was way nicer to work with than Oracle!
- p_ing 2y ago
  SQL Server uses NT and Win32 APIs, so the SQL team built a platform independent layer. Meaning NT and Win32 is still used by SQL on Linux. It’s pretty cool tech. https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/sql-server/blog/2016/12/16/sql-server-on-linux-how-introduction/ https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/sql-server/blog/2016/12/16/s...
- pimeys 2y ago
  I worked with SQL Server a bit, writing a Rust client for it back in the days. The manual is really good, explaining the protocol clearly. That made it really easy to write a client for it. Can't say the same for Oracle...
- pjmlp 2y ago
  Only if you are speaking about SQL Server 7 and earlier, meaning around 2002. Microsoft SQL Server has long stop being Sybase SQL Server, and works on Linux by making use of Drawbridge. https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/sql-server/blog/2016/12/16/sql-server-on-linux-how-introduction/ https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/sql-server/blog/2016/12/16/s...
  - tharkun__ 2y ago
    Of course, that's fair. I guess wording wise for my comment, the "Hah, they didn't actually write that themselves, they just bought the Sybase rights to everything license" got the better of me :) To be fair again, from what I hear, SQL server at Microsoft did some nice things on top of Sybase but the base, T-SQL, is just nice overall and by itself. I really want to like Postgres (and I do) but some of the awesome things I had with actual Sybase ASE 20+ years ago, Postgres still does not have. And that was a piece of software that had those features I loved for 10+ years prior to when I started working with it. The app we're talking of here was 15 years old when I worked on it 20+ years ago and it's probably still around and very probably still uses Sybase ASE (tho the actual app was converted from Smalltalk to Java ;) I also later on had to use Oracle and had the same "WTF? You can't do that?" experience :shrug:

p_ing 2y ago

Are you free to expand upon your role and perhaps some of the actual tech/fixes that made it back into Windows?

Thaxll 2y ago

Like IIS running some part of the code in the kernel? ( http.sys ) :x

p_ing 2y ago
It has its advantages… but wasn’t done until Svr 2003. https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/iis/get-started/introduction-to-iis/introduction-to-iis-architecture#hypertext-transfer-protocol-stack-httpsys https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/iis/get-started/introducti...
- hulitu 2y ago
  > It has its advantages Yeah, the advantages (RCE) were copied by modern web browsers. /s

slt2021 2y ago

Seriously, Windows 2000 was one of the most stable OS back in the day, rock solid. I used 2000 server as a desktop OS, instead of 98. unlike shit show that was windows 95/98/ME

smackeyacky 2y ago
Windows 2000 server was peak windows. All the subsequent versions just got harder to maintain as they gradually ruined the user interface. Nobody cares about the UI on consumer windows but if you’re spending a lot of time in RDP the vista based server products are terrible. I don’t hate windows 2019 but Linux is better, easier, faster and a relief after any futile attempts to use IIS or sql server in 2025.
- aloha2436 2y ago
  > vista based server products are terrible. The first generation of tabletised 8/Metro interfaces made me audibly groan every time I had to RDP into machines running 2012.
  - smackeyacky 2y ago
    Oh yes. I still have a client that has 2012 and it physically hurts to use
  - 9dev 2y ago
    The stuttering over RDP when the start menu animation tried to slide in the tiles was amazing.
- genewitch 2y ago
  windows xp x64 edition was pretty slick; and so was NT4. I agree that 2000 was pretty cool, but perhaps a lot of that is design nostalgia. It was very "serious business OS" where XP and Me looked like jellybeans and cartoons. My favorite windows, though, is win 7 ultimate, Steve Ballmer Edition. i was sad when i had to upgrade to winten. ninja proof: https://i.imgur.com/l29rDVo.jpeg https://i.imgur.com/l29rDVo.jpeg

UltraSane 2y ago

So it is one of the most successful examples of dogfooding in history?