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It 100% looks like they were planning to force a confrontation. Notice how all the escalation is them, they start escalating over basically nothing, and they ke

It 100% looks like they were planning to force a confrontation. Notice how all the escalation is them, they start escalating over basically nothing, and they keep trying to crank up the temperature while Zelenskyy's keeping things nice and even. This didn't happen the last couple times world leaders made far more confrontational statements in a similar setting, but also Vance wasn't there to provide emotional support those times and, well, there are some common sayings about the actual nature of a bully. I think Zelenskyy didn't give them the sound-bites or vibe they were looking for, but they're claiming some kind of victory (WTF) on social media anyway. Meanwhile all they managed to do was look some combination of stupid, childish, and traitorous, while he came out looking incredibly restrained, and overall more-articulate than them despite the handicap of speaking in English rather than his native tongue.

TheOtherHobbes 2y ago
Zelensky used to be a stand-up comedian. He has plenty of experience thinking on his feet in front of a tough audience of drunks and fools. I'm wondering what all the people in the US military and government who swore to protect the US from "all enemies, foreign and domestic" are thinking now.
- alabastervlog 2y ago
  I have to imagine being under non-stop threat of violent death for several years also gives one a rather thick skin.
shostack 2y ago
Sounds like when Jon Stewart went on Crossfire and destroyed Tucker Carlson who had attempted to escalate and get angry. And Jon was like "this is theater."
- PaulDavisThe1st 2y ago
  Carlson was destroyed, but he did not attempt to escalate. He wanted Stewart to get back to "being funny" and got angry when Stewart refused.
  - svachalek 2y ago
    First he wanted to hold Stewart to journalistic standards as a comedian that Carlson was not meeting as an actual journalist and got utterly destroyed in response. He then called for an emergency commercial break, and after the break tried to bait Stewart for not being funny in their interview, despite being completely responsible for the topic. Got utterly destroyed again, and their show got cancelled.
    - alabastervlog 2y ago
      If the past 20 years have taught us anything, including Carlson's history since that segment, it's that this kind of "destroyed" (see also: "destroyed" on Twitter) is not a remotely useful kind of "destroyed", no matter how plain and thorough the destruction.
- dijksterhuis 2y ago
  i'd completely forgotten about this video, i think it's high time to go rewatch it... thanks for the reminder.
  - DrNosferatu 2y ago
    Here: https://youtu.be/Ujh_h0TsI7E https://youtu.be/Ujh_h0TsI7E
- etc-hosts 2y ago
  Tucker got so destroyed that he went onto make 10s of millions a year at Fox, for years, and now he gets to interview fascist skull measurers all day on Twitter.
BrickFingers 2y ago
I disagree that it looked like a planned confrontation and that all the escalation is on Trump and Vance Vance made a comment about the US' goal to be diplomatic. Zelensky speaks up and says he wants to ask Vance something. He then goes on to talk about how Putin annexed Crimea and that between 2014 - 2022 Putin was murdering Ukrainian citizens and ignoring cease fires. He mentioned that nobody did anything to stop Putin, implying that Trump didn't do anything during his first term in office. Then Zelensky ends with something along the lines of "so what do you mean diplomacy" to Vance. Even if Zelensky's statements were correct, that was not a wise course of action to attempt to call out the President and VP while you're in the Oval office. The meeting erupts from there. Regardless of how you feel about the current administration, it is a fact that Ukraine has been dependent on the US' aid. I don't know what Zelensky expected to gain from those statements.
- jimmydoe 2y ago
  My guess is he's being pushed out as president and is forced to sign the deal, by internal political forces who are likely pro-Trump or pro-Putin. This news press is his only chance to potentially flip the script with his public opinion advantage. We will see how that goes.
- hoten 2y ago
  For context, since most clips I've found online start just after JD's comment you're alluding to here- JD's statement about "diplomacy" which precedes Zelensky's comments about how Russia diplomacy plays out starts here: https://youtu.be/CIEZEvx1HfU?si=IdGw2g74643yEQrE&t=45 https://youtu.be/CIEZEvx1HfU?si=IdGw2g74643yEQrE&t=45 I suppose its arguable that it wasn't the most diplomatic thing to say in the moment. But I can't fault the guy for pointing out the undiplomatic behavior while his country is being squeezed by Russia and US (wrt mineral rights). How frustrating it must be to hear "have you tried diplomacy?" in the context of an invading force.
  - BrickFingers 2y ago
    Oh wow, makes sense that the video was clipped. The first video I clicked had the entire segment so I guess I got lucky. I can understand his frustration as well. But, he's a leader at war and lives of his men depend on his actions. The moment is much much bigger than him.
fulladder 2y ago
I disagree. If you watch the entire 50-minute video [1], everything was going very smoothly until the final question. If Trump and Vance had intended to provoke Zelenski, why would they have spent the first ~40 minutes chatting with him amicably and only become heated in response to one specific remark he made at the end? [1] https://thehill.com/video-clips/5168859-watch-live-donald-trump-volodymyr-zelensky-press-conference-minerals-deal/ https://thehill.com/video-clips/5168859-watch-live-donald-tr...

TheOtherHobbes 2y ago

Zelensky used to be a stand-up comedian. He has plenty of experience thinking on his feet in front of a tough audience of drunks and fools. I'm wondering what all the people in the US military and government who swore to protect the US from "all enemies, foreign and domestic" are thinking now.

alabastervlog 2y ago
I have to imagine being under non-stop threat of violent death for several years also gives one a rather thick skin.

shostack 2y ago

Sounds like when Jon Stewart went on Crossfire and destroyed Tucker Carlson who had attempted to escalate and get angry. And Jon was like "this is theater."

PaulDavisThe1st 2y ago
Carlson was destroyed, but he did not attempt to escalate. He wanted Stewart to get back to "being funny" and got angry when Stewart refused.
- svachalek 2y ago
  First he wanted to hold Stewart to journalistic standards as a comedian that Carlson was not meeting as an actual journalist and got utterly destroyed in response. He then called for an emergency commercial break, and after the break tried to bait Stewart for not being funny in their interview, despite being completely responsible for the topic. Got utterly destroyed again, and their show got cancelled.
  - alabastervlog 2y ago
    If the past 20 years have taught us anything, including Carlson's history since that segment, it's that this kind of "destroyed" (see also: "destroyed" on Twitter) is not a remotely useful kind of "destroyed", no matter how plain and thorough the destruction.
dijksterhuis 2y ago
i'd completely forgotten about this video, i think it's high time to go rewatch it... thanks for the reminder.
- DrNosferatu 2y ago
  Here: https://youtu.be/Ujh_h0TsI7E https://youtu.be/Ujh_h0TsI7E
etc-hosts 2y ago
Tucker got so destroyed that he went onto make 10s of millions a year at Fox, for years, and now he gets to interview fascist skull measurers all day on Twitter.

BrickFingers 2y ago

I disagree that it looked like a planned confrontation and that all the escalation is on Trump and Vance Vance made a comment about the US' goal to be diplomatic. Zelensky speaks up and says he wants to ask Vance something. He then goes on to talk about how Putin annexed Crimea and that between 2014 - 2022 Putin was murdering Ukrainian citizens and ignoring cease fires. He mentioned that nobody did anything to stop Putin, implying that Trump didn't do anything during his first term in office. Then Zelensky ends with something along the lines of "so what do you mean diplomacy" to Vance. Even if Zelensky's statements were correct, that was not a wise course of action to attempt to call out the President and VP while you're in the Oval office. The meeting erupts from there. Regardless of how you feel about the current administration, it is a fact that Ukraine has been dependent on the US' aid. I don't know what Zelensky expected to gain from those statements.

jimmydoe 2y ago
My guess is he's being pushed out as president and is forced to sign the deal, by internal political forces who are likely pro-Trump or pro-Putin. This news press is his only chance to potentially flip the script with his public opinion advantage. We will see how that goes.
hoten 2y ago
For context, since most clips I've found online start just after JD's comment you're alluding to here- JD's statement about "diplomacy" which precedes Zelensky's comments about how Russia diplomacy plays out starts here: https://youtu.be/CIEZEvx1HfU?si=IdGw2g74643yEQrE&t=45 https://youtu.be/CIEZEvx1HfU?si=IdGw2g74643yEQrE&t=45 I suppose its arguable that it wasn't the most diplomatic thing to say in the moment. But I can't fault the guy for pointing out the undiplomatic behavior while his country is being squeezed by Russia and US (wrt mineral rights). How frustrating it must be to hear "have you tried diplomacy?" in the context of an invading force.
- BrickFingers 2y ago
  Oh wow, makes sense that the video was clipped. The first video I clicked had the entire segment so I guess I got lucky. I can understand his frustration as well. But, he's a leader at war and lives of his men depend on his actions. The moment is much much bigger than him.

fulladder 2y ago

I disagree. If you watch the entire 50-minute video [1], everything was going very smoothly until the final question. If Trump and Vance had intended to provoke Zelenski, why would they have spent the first ~40 minutes chatting with him amicably and only become heated in response to one specific remark he made at the end? [1] https://thehill.com/video-clips/5168859-watch-live-donald-trump-volodymyr-zelensky-press-conference-minerals-deal/ https://thehill.com/video-clips/5168859-watch-live-donald-tr...