2 ms·

I'm very glad to live in a country where something like this would be considered blatantly illegal.

meitham 2y ago
In the UK and most of the west this is unethical but there is no explicit law that makes it illegal, curious what country you are from that deems this illegal?
- tgsovlerkhgsel 2y ago
  I think any country with GDPR, although some are more known to enforce it aggressively than others. France fining Amazon for similar surveillance based on scanner data: https://www.edpb.europa.eu/news/national-news/2024/employee-monitoring-french-sa-fined-amazon-france-logistique-eu32-million_en https://www.edpb.europa.eu/news/national-news/2024/employee-... Germany issung a 10 million fine to a small (<1000 employees) company: https://www.dataprotectionreport.com/2021/01/new-german-fine-eur-10-4-million-for-unlawful-cctv/ https://www.dataprotectionreport.com/2021/01/new-german-fine... That was "just" CCTV, not an AI panopticon. I think the law (and nearly-guaranteed consequences) are so clear in Germany that few larger companies would be stupid enough to seriously consider something like this, and if they did, any serious Betriebsrat (works council) would put a quick end to it even before the privacy authority could bring the hammer down. Switzerland has laws against behavioral surveillance too, although I'm not sure how the enforcement mechanisms look in practice. But I expect something like this to be too blatant for employers to get away with it. (https://www.edoeb.admin.ch/en/video-surveillance-in-the-workplace https://www.edoeb.admin.ch/en/video-surveillance-in-the-work..., "The use of video surveillance systems for the targeted monitoring of employee behaviour is prohibited".) These rules are explicitly considered health & safety rules due to the psychological harm (stress etc.) that this kind of surveillance causes.
overstay8930 2y ago
Where is something like this illegal?
- phonon 2y ago
  "The European Court of Human Rights has consistently held that video surveillance of an employee in the workplace, whether hidden or not, as well as interception of the content of employee conversations on a work phone, constitutes interference within the meaning of Article 8 of the European Convention for the Protection of Human Rights and Fundamental Freedoms." https://legalitgroup.com/en/employee-monitoring-what-employers-should-consider/ https://legalitgroup.com/en/employee-monitoring-what-employe...
- tgsovlerkhgsel 2y ago
  I've posted a detailed answer here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43180709#43180723 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43180709#43180723

In the UK and most of the west this is unethical but there is no explicit law that makes it illegal, curious what country you are from that deems this illegal?

tgsovlerkhgsel 2y ago
I think any country with GDPR, although some are more known to enforce it aggressively than others. France fining Amazon for similar surveillance based on scanner data: https://www.edpb.europa.eu/news/national-news/2024/employee-monitoring-french-sa-fined-amazon-france-logistique-eu32-million_en https://www.edpb.europa.eu/news/national-news/2024/employee-... Germany issung a 10 million fine to a small (<1000 employees) company: https://www.dataprotectionreport.com/2021/01/new-german-fine-eur-10-4-million-for-unlawful-cctv/ https://www.dataprotectionreport.com/2021/01/new-german-fine... That was "just" CCTV, not an AI panopticon. I think the law (and nearly-guaranteed consequences) are so clear in Germany that few larger companies would be stupid enough to seriously consider something like this, and if they did, any serious Betriebsrat (works council) would put a quick end to it even before the privacy authority could bring the hammer down. Switzerland has laws against behavioral surveillance too, although I'm not sure how the enforcement mechanisms look in practice. But I expect something like this to be too blatant for employers to get away with it. (https://www.edoeb.admin.ch/en/video-surveillance-in-the-workplace https://www.edoeb.admin.ch/en/video-surveillance-in-the-work..., "The use of video surveillance systems for the targeted monitoring of employee behaviour is prohibited".) These rules are explicitly considered health & safety rules due to the psychological harm (stress etc.) that this kind of surveillance causes.

overstay8930 2y ago

Where is something like this illegal?

phonon 2y ago
"The European Court of Human Rights has consistently held that video surveillance of an employee in the workplace, whether hidden or not, as well as interception of the content of employee conversations on a work phone, constitutes interference within the meaning of Article 8 of the European Convention for the Protection of Human Rights and Fundamental Freedoms." https://legalitgroup.com/en/employee-monitoring-what-employers-should-consider/ https://legalitgroup.com/en/employee-monitoring-what-employe...
tgsovlerkhgsel 2y ago
I've posted a detailed answer here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43180709#43180723 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43180709#43180723