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Most people soon forget and really don't care about these things. The Volkswagen company originated during the Third Reich in an attempt to create an affordabl

Most people soon forget and really don't care about these things. The Volkswagen company originated during the Third Reich in an attempt to create an affordable car for the German people. Volkswagen used both Jewish and non-Jewish forced labor, primarily from eastern Europe. The company operated four concentration camps and eight forced-labor camps on its property. 7 Brands With Nazi Ties That We All Use https://allthatsinteresting.com/major-brands-nazi-collaborators/2 https://allthatsinteresting.com/major-brands-nazi-collaborat...

marcuschong 2y ago
I'd argue that, as horrible as that was, it wasn't as centered in one person as famous and important as Musk. Like buying phones we know were perhaps made by people treated like slaves in China, versus buying something that is represented by one famous person that wants to bring back slavery.
aredox 2y ago
At least you could buy a VW from 1945 on and not finance the Nazi war machine. But before that? You were a clear collaborator.
KeplerBoy 2y ago
What a ridiculous comparison! VW didn't even build cars for consumers during the war years.
- nntwozz 2y ago
  People selling their Teslas afraid of associating with Musk is the topic here and the point I'm making is that the current political climate around this company will be a footnote in history that most people will care little about (if not already). This too shall pass, frankly I think it's a form of cringe virtue signaling. It's also a form of collective punishment, "I won't buy Tesla because I don't like Elon" is certainly a valid opinion, but what about all the workers who have nothing to do with his politics?
  - short_sells_poo 2y ago
    > but what about all the workers who have nothing to do with his politics? This is a preposterous argument, I'm sorry. Should I feel sorry for people who enable Musk's antics? Why? They get paid very well to work for him I'm sure. I disagree with Musk's antics and as such I'm not going to give him money. What's so difficult to understand about this? I don't care that in 20 years time he'll be forgotten. We are here and now, and the best way to send him a message that what he is doing is not OK is by hurting his wallet.
    - nntwozz 2y ago
      You're sending a message to Elon about as much as sending a message to Mars Inc by not buying a Snickers bar. Sending "real" messages is more than not buying things from companies or people you don't like and then virtue signaling about it online from the comfort of your armchair. I think it's highfalutin.
      - short_sells_poo 2y ago
        So you are saying I should instead happily give him my money even though I deeply disagree with what he's doing? Let's take your argument ad absurdum: you'd happily give money to a mass murder as long as he was making a product you like?
        nntwozz 2y ago
        I'm not saying you should do anything, but many people will buy Tesla because they don't see Tesla and Elon as the same thing.
        short_sells_poo 2y ago
        Yes and many people don't. What is your point? Many people are upset with what Elon is doing, that's what is being discussed. Like it or not, Tesla and Elon are the same thing. It's his choice. He wants to be the public face of a company, he can't then selectively choose to shield said company from his antics when they backfire. Nothing stopped Elon from divesting himself of his commercial holdings and announce that he wants to enter politics. Then I, and many others, would have no qualms about buying Tesla cars. Obviously, doing so would've required a degree of personal integrity and humility, which he seems to be lacking.
- jordanb 2y ago
  Yeah the whole "people's car" was actually a Nazi memcoin rug-pull scam. They got millions of Germans to put down deposits and make payments for "future delivery" of their "people's car" but zero were ever delivered during the third reich.
palata 2y ago
Do you think many people opposing the Nazis were buying VWs during the war? "Those Nazis are killing our soldiers right now in the north, but I will still buy one of their good cars", said nobody.
- nntwozz 2y ago
  That's a moot point. Tesla was making cars before Musk became what he is today.
  - palata 2y ago
    Moot or not, I won't buy a Tesla after what Must has become, and I will shame whoever does.
    - nntwozz 2y ago
      I'm sure you've got a very high horse.
    - senordevnyc 2y ago
      I won't shame anyone for it, but it does factor into my view of their values.
ZeroGravitas 2y ago
The British Military Government rebooted Volkswagen after they firebombed the Nazis to the ground and hung a few of the ringleaders. https://www.volkswagen-group.com/en/volkswagen-chronicle-17351/1945-to-1949-the-work-of-the-british-17355# https://www.volkswagen-group.com/en/volkswagen-chronicle-173...
pjc50 2y ago
Making decisions about VW based on 80 years ago is silly. The 2020s reason to hate VW is their lying about emissions scandal.
- nntwozz 2y ago
  Yep, for sure. But even that goes to my point, people still buy VW because they're either ignorant or soon forget these things. This is the world we live in.
  - senordevnyc 2y ago
    We have very different ideas of the word "soon".
rsynnott 2y ago
And now it's a public company with a CEO so obscure that he _does not even have a wikipedia page_. "Oh, well, Ford and VW used to be run by evil bastards most of a century ago so it's improper to point out that Tesla currently is" is a bizarre argument.

marcuschong 2y ago

I'd argue that, as horrible as that was, it wasn't as centered in one person as famous and important as Musk. Like buying phones we know were perhaps made by people treated like slaves in China, versus buying something that is represented by one famous person that wants to bring back slavery.

aredox 2y ago

At least you could buy a VW from 1945 on and not finance the Nazi war machine. But before that? You were a clear collaborator.

KeplerBoy 2y ago

What a ridiculous comparison! VW didn't even build cars for consumers during the war years.

nntwozz 2y ago
People selling their Teslas afraid of associating with Musk is the topic here and the point I'm making is that the current political climate around this company will be a footnote in history that most people will care little about (if not already). This too shall pass, frankly I think it's a form of cringe virtue signaling. It's also a form of collective punishment, "I won't buy Tesla because I don't like Elon" is certainly a valid opinion, but what about all the workers who have nothing to do with his politics?
- short_sells_poo 2y ago
  > but what about all the workers who have nothing to do with his politics? This is a preposterous argument, I'm sorry. Should I feel sorry for people who enable Musk's antics? Why? They get paid very well to work for him I'm sure. I disagree with Musk's antics and as such I'm not going to give him money. What's so difficult to understand about this? I don't care that in 20 years time he'll be forgotten. We are here and now, and the best way to send him a message that what he is doing is not OK is by hurting his wallet.
  - nntwozz 2y ago
    You're sending a message to Elon about as much as sending a message to Mars Inc by not buying a Snickers bar. Sending "real" messages is more than not buying things from companies or people you don't like and then virtue signaling about it online from the comfort of your armchair. I think it's highfalutin.
    - short_sells_poo 2y ago
      So you are saying I should instead happily give him my money even though I deeply disagree with what he's doing? Let's take your argument ad absurdum: you'd happily give money to a mass murder as long as he was making a product you like?
      - nntwozz 2y ago
        I'm not saying you should do anything, but many people will buy Tesla because they don't see Tesla and Elon as the same thing.
        short_sells_poo 2y ago
        Yes and many people don't. What is your point? Many people are upset with what Elon is doing, that's what is being discussed. Like it or not, Tesla and Elon are the same thing. It's his choice. He wants to be the public face of a company, he can't then selectively choose to shield said company from his antics when they backfire. Nothing stopped Elon from divesting himself of his commercial holdings and announce that he wants to enter politics. Then I, and many others, would have no qualms about buying Tesla cars. Obviously, doing so would've required a degree of personal integrity and humility, which he seems to be lacking.
jordanb 2y ago
Yeah the whole "people's car" was actually a Nazi memcoin rug-pull scam. They got millions of Germans to put down deposits and make payments for "future delivery" of their "people's car" but zero were ever delivered during the third reich.

palata 2y ago

Do you think many people opposing the Nazis were buying VWs during the war? "Those Nazis are killing our soldiers right now in the north, but I will still buy one of their good cars", said nobody.

nntwozz 2y ago
That's a moot point. Tesla was making cars before Musk became what he is today.
- palata 2y ago
  Moot or not, I won't buy a Tesla after what Must has become, and I will shame whoever does.
  - nntwozz 2y ago
    I'm sure you've got a very high horse.
  - senordevnyc 2y ago
    I won't shame anyone for it, but it does factor into my view of their values.

ZeroGravitas 2y ago

The British Military Government rebooted Volkswagen after they firebombed the Nazis to the ground and hung a few of the ringleaders. https://www.volkswagen-group.com/en/volkswagen-chronicle-17351/1945-to-1949-the-work-of-the-british-17355# https://www.volkswagen-group.com/en/volkswagen-chronicle-173...

pjc50 2y ago

Making decisions about VW based on 80 years ago is silly. The 2020s reason to hate VW is their lying about emissions scandal.

nntwozz 2y ago
Yep, for sure. But even that goes to my point, people still buy VW because they're either ignorant or soon forget these things. This is the world we live in.
- senordevnyc 2y ago
  We have very different ideas of the word "soon".

rsynnott 2y ago

And now it's a public company with a CEO so obscure that he _does not even have a wikipedia page_. "Oh, well, Ford and VW used to be run by evil bastards most of a century ago so it's improper to point out that Tesla currently is" is a bizarre argument.