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I imagine bringing up the current situation with John Deere and how the law would enshrine the right to repair the tractor that you bought with your own money w

I imagine bringing up the current situation with John Deere and how the law would enshrine the right to repair the tractor that you bought with your own money would go farther than most arguments with those folks.

hoten 2y ago
It's an interesting idea. But I like to think if they owned equipment like that, they'd already be on the side of right-to-repair. Farmers are smart businessmen and this is an obviously needless extra cost. But for the non-farmers, perhaps it'd really sway tribal mindsets to understand people "similar to them" (more so than elite techies...) benefit too.
potato3732842 2y ago
He's just advertising the filter bubble he lives in. Everyone wants owners to be able to be able to access the info they need to repair things. About the only gripe you'll hear from the most hardline libertarians is "that's not the government's job" and even then it's usually prefixed with "this is nice but". Occasionally some Karen who hasn't really put much thought into it will screech about "but what it someone repairs something wrong and makes it unsafe" as if supposed professionals don't do that all the time and right to repair isn't just as much about enabling individual professionals as it is owners.
- asacrowflies 2y ago
  I did receive the "it's not the governments job" speech but they had no rebuttal when I asked about border agents seizing official refurb apple parts as "counterfeit" or Microsoft jailing someone trying to keep old PCs out of landfill... Or the concept of IP as a whole and the John Deere tractor example someone else replied to me with in this thread . As if I'm blind or stupid and wouldn't try the obvious?? You can't reason people out of positions they didn't reason into
  - AnthonyMouse 2y ago
    > they had no rebuttal when I asked about border agents seizing official refurb apple parts as "counterfeit" or Microsoft jailing someone trying to keep old PCs out of landfill... Or the concept of IP as a whole and the John Deere tractor example someone else replied to me with in this thread . They have no rebuttal because you're now making their own arguments. Regulations that allow those parts to be seized or those people to be jailed should be repealed. In general the libertarian position is that problems like this would be solved by competition if there weren't government regulations stifling competition. And they're often right. DMCA 1201 impairs adversarial interoperability and therefore competition. Trademark law is meant to be about consumer protection and accurately representing the source of goods to the consumer, not enabling price discrimination by putting up trade barriers to cross-border arbitrage. But a lot of those bad laws, they're federal. So if all you have control over is a state legislature, and those laws exist and have impaired competition and the state legislature can't remove federal laws, you then have to ask what they can do about the problems caused by those laws, until such time as we can get them repealed at the federal level. If you want a fun compromise, pass a right to repair bill that only applies to companies with more than a billion dollars in revenue (but using the largest entity in the supply chain, so you can't just use a small business as a middle man to get out of it). That's going to make it apply to any of the relevant companies, but then if you ever managed to actually make those markets competitive enough for smaller businesses to be viable, you don't have yet another rule stacking on more barriers to entry for small businesses.
    - asacrowflies 2y ago
      Interesting how you seem to know more about my personal anecdote and experience than myself??? You where there apparently so tell me more lmao.... I'm not going to bother to address most of your comment because of this.... but just.... Unbelievably rude and arrogant of you lol. Par for libertarians. Anyway no they where not libertarians they where MAGA as I stated. They weren't interested in any of the BS you espoused. Things seized at border? Must be dangerous or illegal ,good on our boys in blue.ppl in jail? Must be protecting society.. OBVIOUSLY innocent citizens don't go to jail. Etc etc. Don't believe climate change is real at all Don't believe COVID is real or was real. At all. Highly evangelical Christian while being the most unchristlike beings imaginable. MAGA BULLSHIT not libertarians...
asacrowflies 2y ago
Doesnt work. Nor examples of apple screen being seized as "counterfeit" nor blatant abuses by Microsoft or Nintendo that has ppl JAILED for doing what they will with their own property. They don't really listen to reason. Right to repair sounds" nice" and like it might help poor people .... So they will fight it to the death as socialism handouts.

hoten 2y ago

It's an interesting idea. But I like to think if they owned equipment like that, they'd already be on the side of right-to-repair. Farmers are smart businessmen and this is an obviously needless extra cost. But for the non-farmers, perhaps it'd really sway tribal mindsets to understand people "similar to them" (more so than elite techies...) benefit too.

potato3732842 2y ago

He's just advertising the filter bubble he lives in. Everyone wants owners to be able to be able to access the info they need to repair things. About the only gripe you'll hear from the most hardline libertarians is "that's not the government's job" and even then it's usually prefixed with "this is nice but". Occasionally some Karen who hasn't really put much thought into it will screech about "but what it someone repairs something wrong and makes it unsafe" as if supposed professionals don't do that all the time and right to repair isn't just as much about enabling individual professionals as it is owners.

asacrowflies 2y ago
I did receive the "it's not the governments job" speech but they had no rebuttal when I asked about border agents seizing official refurb apple parts as "counterfeit" or Microsoft jailing someone trying to keep old PCs out of landfill... Or the concept of IP as a whole and the John Deere tractor example someone else replied to me with in this thread . As if I'm blind or stupid and wouldn't try the obvious?? You can't reason people out of positions they didn't reason into
- AnthonyMouse 2y ago
  > they had no rebuttal when I asked about border agents seizing official refurb apple parts as "counterfeit" or Microsoft jailing someone trying to keep old PCs out of landfill... Or the concept of IP as a whole and the John Deere tractor example someone else replied to me with in this thread . They have no rebuttal because you're now making their own arguments. Regulations that allow those parts to be seized or those people to be jailed should be repealed. In general the libertarian position is that problems like this would be solved by competition if there weren't government regulations stifling competition. And they're often right. DMCA 1201 impairs adversarial interoperability and therefore competition. Trademark law is meant to be about consumer protection and accurately representing the source of goods to the consumer, not enabling price discrimination by putting up trade barriers to cross-border arbitrage. But a lot of those bad laws, they're federal. So if all you have control over is a state legislature, and those laws exist and have impaired competition and the state legislature can't remove federal laws, you then have to ask what they can do about the problems caused by those laws, until such time as we can get them repealed at the federal level. If you want a fun compromise, pass a right to repair bill that only applies to companies with more than a billion dollars in revenue (but using the largest entity in the supply chain, so you can't just use a small business as a middle man to get out of it). That's going to make it apply to any of the relevant companies, but then if you ever managed to actually make those markets competitive enough for smaller businesses to be viable, you don't have yet another rule stacking on more barriers to entry for small businesses.
  - asacrowflies 2y ago
    Interesting how you seem to know more about my personal anecdote and experience than myself??? You where there apparently so tell me more lmao.... I'm not going to bother to address most of your comment because of this.... but just.... Unbelievably rude and arrogant of you lol. Par for libertarians. Anyway no they where not libertarians they where MAGA as I stated. They weren't interested in any of the BS you espoused. Things seized at border? Must be dangerous or illegal ,good on our boys in blue.ppl in jail? Must be protecting society.. OBVIOUSLY innocent citizens don't go to jail. Etc etc. Don't believe climate change is real at all Don't believe COVID is real or was real. At all. Highly evangelical Christian while being the most unchristlike beings imaginable. MAGA BULLSHIT not libertarians...

asacrowflies 2y ago

Doesnt work. Nor examples of apple screen being seized as "counterfeit" nor blatant abuses by Microsoft or Nintendo that has ppl JAILED for doing what they will with their own property. They don't really listen to reason. Right to repair sounds" nice" and like it might help poor people .... So they will fight it to the death as socialism handouts.