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> they really didn’t have a choice here They did have a choice. They could have said they will just get out of UK. That would have resulted in enough political

> they really didn’t have a choice here They did have a choice. They could have said they will just get out of UK. That would have resulted in enough political turmoil in UK that their government would roll back this stupid law. Apple chickened out.

nobankai 2y ago
Abandoning the UK market would hurt Apple more than it would hurt the UK. They are not a nation-state, Apple cannot wage diplomacy by threatening the government, they can only shoot their own foot off and say it was for the good of everyone. It would also partially validate the EU's regulation if they abandoned the UK but stayed in Europe. Apple very much doesn't want to feed either side a line.
- busymom0 2y ago
  They could have started with not offering iCloud at all in UK. See how the blowback gets UK government to play ball and rollback the law. It may have hurt Apple in the short term but helped in the long term.
  - thewebguyd 2y ago
    Then instead of mandating a backdoor to cloud data, the UK would just mandate backdoor access to the devices themselves, again forcing Apple's hand to either comply or GTFO, if they want it bad enough. We're losing the fight, and people are as apathetic as ever around privacy and security issues. Besides, never trust E2EE where you don't control both ends, but everyone here should have already known that.
scarface_74 2y ago
If the UK wants the law to change, that’s up to the citizens of the UK. These are the people they elected. Don’t expect Apple to rescue the UK citizens to from their own choices.
- busymom0 2y ago
  So, Apple will just give in to whoever is in power? They were not this soft in the San Bernardino case when FBI asked them to unlock a phone.
  - scarface_74 2y ago
    The FBI doesn’t create laws. If Congress had passed a law then you would have a good analogy. Yes Apple follows the laws of every country it operates in just like any other company.
    - ImJamal 2y ago
      There is an easy way to avoid having to follow laws of a country. Don't operate in that country.
      - ben_w 2y ago
        If you don't want to be sued by activist investors, you need a good reason for that, and to be able to tell those investors what else you tried first before escalating that far if you eventually do pull out of a market.
    - maeil 2y ago
      Apple absolutely does not follow the laws of every country it operates in, else TikTok wouldn't be back on the App Store.
      - scarface_74 2y ago
        If only I had thought about that, I might have mentioned it. Oh wait https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43128684 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43128684 > Now going back on Twitter to get in the good graces of President Musk and bringing TikTok back to the AppStore even though it is clearly against the law is different.
kandesbunzler 2y ago
[flagged]

nobankai 2y ago

Abandoning the UK market would hurt Apple more than it would hurt the UK. They are not a nation-state, Apple cannot wage diplomacy by threatening the government, they can only shoot their own foot off and say it was for the good of everyone. It would also partially validate the EU's regulation if they abandoned the UK but stayed in Europe. Apple very much doesn't want to feed either side a line.

busymom0 2y ago
They could have started with not offering iCloud at all in UK. See how the blowback gets UK government to play ball and rollback the law. It may have hurt Apple in the short term but helped in the long term.
- thewebguyd 2y ago
  Then instead of mandating a backdoor to cloud data, the UK would just mandate backdoor access to the devices themselves, again forcing Apple's hand to either comply or GTFO, if they want it bad enough. We're losing the fight, and people are as apathetic as ever around privacy and security issues. Besides, never trust E2EE where you don't control both ends, but everyone here should have already known that.

scarface_74 2y ago

If the UK wants the law to change, that’s up to the citizens of the UK. These are the people they elected. Don’t expect Apple to rescue the UK citizens to from their own choices.

busymom0 2y ago
So, Apple will just give in to whoever is in power? They were not this soft in the San Bernardino case when FBI asked them to unlock a phone.
- scarface_74 2y ago
  The FBI doesn’t create laws. If Congress had passed a law then you would have a good analogy. Yes Apple follows the laws of every country it operates in just like any other company.
  - ImJamal 2y ago
    There is an easy way to avoid having to follow laws of a country. Don't operate in that country.
    - ben_w 2y ago
      If you don't want to be sued by activist investors, you need a good reason for that, and to be able to tell those investors what else you tried first before escalating that far if you eventually do pull out of a market.
  - maeil 2y ago
    Apple absolutely does not follow the laws of every country it operates in, else TikTok wouldn't be back on the App Store.
    - scarface_74 2y ago
      If only I had thought about that, I might have mentioned it. Oh wait https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43128684 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43128684 > Now going back on Twitter to get in the good graces of President Musk and bringing TikTok back to the AppStore even though it is clearly against the law is different.

kandesbunzler 2y ago

[flagged]