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Anytime I see a picture of North Korea I think 1) is the person now banned? 2) did insiders get punished? For this one, I worry for those insiders. They made

Anytime I see a picture of North Korea I think 1) is the person now banned? 2) did insiders get punished? For this one, I worry for those insiders. They made their choice but I can’t imagine Kim is happy this got out.

whamlastxmas 2y ago
The article isn’t exactly hard hitting. It debunks myths that make North Korea look bad, doesn’t talk about how many people died making it, etc
- gwern 2y ago
  > Having visited the hermit state around 200 times through working as a tour guide He's a regime supporter who brings in desperately needed foreign currency to help pay for the nuke & missile program and elite luxuries. Hence, given that he has talked about and posted this, he is almost certainly correct when he says > Some media has portrayed the idea that North Koreans are embarrassed by the empty hotel or the length of time it took to finish, Cockerell said, "but I never found that to be true"..."That's ludicrous, and never been true. Absolute nonsense. It used to appear on the front of books and magazines, even when it was an incomplete concrete shell with a crane up top. So that's complete rubbish. It was not a cause for embarrassment." Cockerell said the Kim family simply put the blame on America, falsely explaining to the North Korean people that the delays were "the fault of jealous conspiracies" from outside Western powers...Cockerell has also observed how Pyongyang locals interact with the structure. "It's not like people sit on their balconies, watching the slogans go by. It's just part of the nightlife. It's a futuristic building to North Koreans, very modern, unlike anything else." That is, this post is sort of a quasi 'submarine' for North Korean tourism. 'Come see our unique pyramid, which we think is cool rather than a symptom of totalitarian dictatorship (and pay us a lot of renminbi/dollars/yen)!'
kstrauser 2y ago
When I see pictures, I'm always surprised by how relatively normal it looks from a distance. I guess I pictured it more 1984 style, with grey cubed buildings and zero trees, decoration, or anything else pleasant. From a distance, it seems remarkably normal to me. I have no desire to visit and certainly wouldn't want to live there, but it looks not all that bad.
- robotnikman 2y ago
  It could all be an example of a 'Potemkin village' https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Potemkin_village https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Potemkin_village
  - annzabelle 2y ago
    Everything westerners are allowed to see or film in NK is a Potemkin Village. The tours are very tightly controlled.
qingcharles 2y ago
Simon has unprecedented access to NK. More than any other Westerner, I think. He's been doing this for so long, without reprisal, that I think he must know where the line is on what he can publicly document. If you meet him, ask him about the other stuff he can't document... :)
- pydry 2y ago
  I went on one of his tours and during the annual military parade I watched him wander all over the route while we watched from one spot. I caught up and was like "wtf can we do this? they dont mind?" He told me yea, no problem go wherever you like in the parade just dont do anything stupid. So we did. He was very clear about when we needed to hold back, but also knew exactly which boundaries could be pushed.
Synaesthesia 2y ago
There's some kind of cartoonist supervillian picture of North Korea. It's quite surprising when you learn that it's a country filled with ordinary people, doing ordinary things like us. Yes it's incredibly paranoid and authoritarian, but when you learn the history it makes sense why it is like that. This is a country that was utterly destroyed by a superpower, who crowed about it, and which still threatens it.
- jiggawatts 2y ago
  A much better model is that it is ruled by the Kim family as a dictatorship for the last eighty years. Wars, other countries, and the like are mere sideshows. Sure, they influenced NK’s history, but fundamentally it is a story of autocratic rule more than anything else.
  - latentcall 2y ago
    At least they get free healthcare!

whamlastxmas 2y ago

The article isn’t exactly hard hitting. It debunks myths that make North Korea look bad, doesn’t talk about how many people died making it, etc

gwern 2y ago
> Having visited the hermit state around 200 times through working as a tour guide He's a regime supporter who brings in desperately needed foreign currency to help pay for the nuke & missile program and elite luxuries. Hence, given that he has talked about and posted this, he is almost certainly correct when he says > Some media has portrayed the idea that North Koreans are embarrassed by the empty hotel or the length of time it took to finish, Cockerell said, "but I never found that to be true"..."That's ludicrous, and never been true. Absolute nonsense. It used to appear on the front of books and magazines, even when it was an incomplete concrete shell with a crane up top. So that's complete rubbish. It was not a cause for embarrassment." Cockerell said the Kim family simply put the blame on America, falsely explaining to the North Korean people that the delays were "the fault of jealous conspiracies" from outside Western powers...Cockerell has also observed how Pyongyang locals interact with the structure. "It's not like people sit on their balconies, watching the slogans go by. It's just part of the nightlife. It's a futuristic building to North Koreans, very modern, unlike anything else." That is, this post is sort of a quasi 'submarine' for North Korean tourism. 'Come see our unique pyramid, which we think is cool rather than a symptom of totalitarian dictatorship (and pay us a lot of renminbi/dollars/yen)!'

kstrauser 2y ago

When I see pictures, I'm always surprised by how relatively normal it looks from a distance. I guess I pictured it more 1984 style, with grey cubed buildings and zero trees, decoration, or anything else pleasant. From a distance, it seems remarkably normal to me. I have no desire to visit and certainly wouldn't want to live there, but it looks not all that bad.

robotnikman 2y ago
It could all be an example of a 'Potemkin village' https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Potemkin_village https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Potemkin_village
- annzabelle 2y ago
  Everything westerners are allowed to see or film in NK is a Potemkin Village. The tours are very tightly controlled.

qingcharles 2y ago

Simon has unprecedented access to NK. More than any other Westerner, I think. He's been doing this for so long, without reprisal, that I think he must know where the line is on what he can publicly document. If you meet him, ask him about the other stuff he can't document... :)

pydry 2y ago
I went on one of his tours and during the annual military parade I watched him wander all over the route while we watched from one spot. I caught up and was like "wtf can we do this? they dont mind?" He told me yea, no problem go wherever you like in the parade just dont do anything stupid. So we did. He was very clear about when we needed to hold back, but also knew exactly which boundaries could be pushed.

Synaesthesia 2y ago

There's some kind of cartoonist supervillian picture of North Korea. It's quite surprising when you learn that it's a country filled with ordinary people, doing ordinary things like us. Yes it's incredibly paranoid and authoritarian, but when you learn the history it makes sense why it is like that. This is a country that was utterly destroyed by a superpower, who crowed about it, and which still threatens it.

jiggawatts 2y ago
A much better model is that it is ruled by the Kim family as a dictatorship for the last eighty years. Wars, other countries, and the like are mere sideshows. Sure, they influenced NK’s history, but fundamentally it is a story of autocratic rule more than anything else.
- latentcall 2y ago
  At least they get free healthcare!