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And none of those roads exist within the congestion zone. In fact, as long as you remain on the highways (The West Side Highway and FDR drives -- both of which

And none of those roads exist within the congestion zone. In fact, as long as you remain on the highways (The West Side Highway and FDR drives -- both of which are local/state roads) on the periphery of the zone, you pay no fee. Which makes your argument completely specious since there are no Interstate highways within the confines of the congestion zone.

AnthonyMouse 2y ago
They go directly into the congestion zone. I-78 goes through the Holland Tunnel and drops you out in lower Manhattan. Once you're in New York, every exit is in the congestion zone until the end of the highway. Moreover, the highway's purpose is to carry people into Manhattan. Discouraging people from using the interstate highway to go to New York is the thing to be prevented.
- nobody9999 2y ago
  >They go directly into the congestion zone. I-78 goes through the Holland Tunnel and drops you out in lower Manhattan. Once you're in New York, every exit is in the congestion zone until the end of the highway. Don't want to go into the congestion zone? Take the GW Bridge or Battery tunnel. Otherwise, pay up ya cheap bastard! >Moreover, the highway's purpose is to carry people into Manhattan. Discouraging people from using the interstate highway to go to New York is the thing to be prevented. Boo hoo! If NJ folks never come to Manhattan (by whatever means) it will be too many. Take the train or the bus or pay up ya cheap bastard. tl;dr: Leave your car at home.
  - AnthonyMouse 2y ago
    > Don't want to go into the congestion zone? Take the GW Bridge or Battery tunnel. They do want to go there. They want to use the federally-funded interstate highway to go to the place their tax dollars paid for it to go, and which they have the right as a citizen of the US to travel to, without being deterred from using it by local politicians discriminating against out-of-state people who can't vote against them. > If NJ folks never come to Manhattan (by whatever means) it will be too many. I feel like you're just making my point for me now.
    - nobody9999 2y ago
      >They do want to go there. Of course they do. And they need to respect the wishes, and more importantly, the laws and regulations within those political boundaries. Manhattan isn't a playground for entitled jackasses like you. It's home to 1,000,000 human beings. Do you have so little respect for your fellow Americans that you will happily pollute their homes with noxious gases, noise and the stench of automobiles? I'd also note that you aren't making the same argument about the toll roads in New Jersey. Heck, if I use those roads I'm almost certainly not going anywhere in New Jersey. Which is distinct from a specific destination. I find your apparent lack of self awareness and disdain for your fellow humans disgusting. Have a nice day. Edit: Fixed typo.
      - AnthonyMouse 2y ago
        > And they need to respect the wishes, and more importantly, the laws and regulations within those political boundaries. Those laws include the federal laws which are now being applied. > Do you have so little respect for your fellow Americans that you will happily pollute their homes with noxious gases, noise and the stench of automobiles? Those Manhattan residents are heating their residences with predominantly fuel oil and natural gas. If we're constraining the combustion of things they're going to be pretty cold. I've been inside the New York City subway system; it smells strongly of brake dust and the electrical contact shoes generate a significant amount of ozone from arcing. Are we going to discontinue running those too? Everything has costs. And electric cars have no local exhaust emissions and significantly reduced brake dust from regenerative braking, are you proposing they be exempt from the congestion charge? That isn't currently the case. > I'd also note that you aren't making the same argument about the toll roads in New Jersey. No, you can see elsewhere in the thread that I am. They should get rid of all toll roads everywhere. The argument there is different because the purpose of the toll there is strictly revenue generation rather than purposefully deterring usage, but tolls are still an inefficient and privacy invasive method of funding government programs and should not be used. Use fuel taxes (which promote more efficient vehicles and help to price carbon) or general taxes instead. It's also not productive to make emotional appeals and personal attacks. It's politics, people get heated; make an argument, not a scene.

AnthonyMouse 2y ago

They go directly into the congestion zone. I-78 goes through the Holland Tunnel and drops you out in lower Manhattan. Once you're in New York, every exit is in the congestion zone until the end of the highway. Moreover, the highway's purpose is to carry people into Manhattan. Discouraging people from using the interstate highway to go to New York is the thing to be prevented.

nobody9999 2y ago
>They go directly into the congestion zone. I-78 goes through the Holland Tunnel and drops you out in lower Manhattan. Once you're in New York, every exit is in the congestion zone until the end of the highway. Don't want to go into the congestion zone? Take the GW Bridge or Battery tunnel. Otherwise, pay up ya cheap bastard! >Moreover, the highway's purpose is to carry people into Manhattan. Discouraging people from using the interstate highway to go to New York is the thing to be prevented. Boo hoo! If NJ folks never come to Manhattan (by whatever means) it will be too many. Take the train or the bus or pay up ya cheap bastard. tl;dr: Leave your car at home.
- AnthonyMouse 2y ago
  > Don't want to go into the congestion zone? Take the GW Bridge or Battery tunnel. They do want to go there. They want to use the federally-funded interstate highway to go to the place their tax dollars paid for it to go, and which they have the right as a citizen of the US to travel to, without being deterred from using it by local politicians discriminating against out-of-state people who can't vote against them. > If NJ folks never come to Manhattan (by whatever means) it will be too many. I feel like you're just making my point for me now.
  - nobody9999 2y ago
    >They do want to go there. Of course they do. And they need to respect the wishes, and more importantly, the laws and regulations within those political boundaries. Manhattan isn't a playground for entitled jackasses like you. It's home to 1,000,000 human beings. Do you have so little respect for your fellow Americans that you will happily pollute their homes with noxious gases, noise and the stench of automobiles? I'd also note that you aren't making the same argument about the toll roads in New Jersey. Heck, if I use those roads I'm almost certainly not going anywhere in New Jersey. Which is distinct from a specific destination. I find your apparent lack of self awareness and disdain for your fellow humans disgusting. Have a nice day. Edit: Fixed typo.
    - AnthonyMouse 2y ago
      > And they need to respect the wishes, and more importantly, the laws and regulations within those political boundaries. Those laws include the federal laws which are now being applied. > Do you have so little respect for your fellow Americans that you will happily pollute their homes with noxious gases, noise and the stench of automobiles? Those Manhattan residents are heating their residences with predominantly fuel oil and natural gas. If we're constraining the combustion of things they're going to be pretty cold. I've been inside the New York City subway system; it smells strongly of brake dust and the electrical contact shoes generate a significant amount of ozone from arcing. Are we going to discontinue running those too? Everything has costs. And electric cars have no local exhaust emissions and significantly reduced brake dust from regenerative braking, are you proposing they be exempt from the congestion charge? That isn't currently the case. > I'd also note that you aren't making the same argument about the toll roads in New Jersey. No, you can see elsewhere in the thread that I am. They should get rid of all toll roads everywhere. The argument there is different because the purpose of the toll there is strictly revenue generation rather than purposefully deterring usage, but tolls are still an inefficient and privacy invasive method of funding government programs and should not be used. Use fuel taxes (which promote more efficient vehicles and help to price carbon) or general taxes instead. It's also not productive to make emotional appeals and personal attacks. It's politics, people get heated; make an argument, not a scene.