4 ms·

1 file, 2 files, N files, why does it matter how many files? Use a lock file if you want transitive dependencies pinned. I can't think of any other language w

1 file, 2 files, N files, why does it matter how many files? Use a lock file if you want transitive dependencies pinned. I can't think of any other language where "I want my script to use dependencies from the Internet, pinned to precise versions" is a thing.

hannibalhorn 2y ago
If there's a language that does this right, all ears? But I havn't seen it - The use case described is for a small one off script for use in CI, or a single file script you send off to a colleague over Slack. Very, very common scenario for many of us. If your script depends on a => c b => c You can pin versions of those direct dependencies like "a" and "b" easy enough, but 2 years later you may not get the same version of "c", unless the authors of "a" and "b" handle their dependency constraints perfectly. In practice that's really hard and never happens. The timestamp appraoch described above isn't perfect, but would result in the same dep graph, and results, 99% of the time..
- __s 2y ago
  Rust tends to handle this well. It'll share c if possible, or split dependencies. Cargo.lock preserves exact resolution
- lmm 2y ago
  Try Scala with an Ammonite script like https://ammonite.io/#ScalaScripts https://ammonite.io/#ScalaScripts . The JVM ecosystem does dependencies right, there's no need to "pin" in the first place because dependency resolution is deterministic to start with. (Upgrading to e.g. all newer patch versions of your current dependencies is easy, but you have to make an explicit action to do so, it will never happen "magically")
kokada 2y ago
> 1 file, 2 files, N files, why does it matter how many files? One file is better for sharing than N, you can post it in a messenger program like Slack and easily copy-and-paste (while this becomes annoying with more than one file), or upload this somewhere without needing to compress, etc. > I can't think of any other language where "I want my script to use dependencies from the Internet, pinned to precise versions" is a thing. This is the same issue you would have in any other programming language. If it is fine for possibly having breakage in the future you don't need to do it, but I can understand the use case for it.
lenkite 2y ago
For N scripts, you will need N lock files littering your directories and then need venvs for all of them. Sometimes, the lock files can be larger than the scripts themselves...
epistasis 2y ago
I think it's a general principle across all of software engineering that, when given the choice, fewer disparate locations in the codebase need to have correlated changes. Documentation is hard enough, and that's often right there at exactly the same location.
deanishe 2y ago
> why does it matter how many files? Because this is for scripts in ~/bin, not projects. They need to be self-contained.

hannibalhorn 2y ago

If there's a language that does this right, all ears? But I havn't seen it - The use case described is for a small one off script for use in CI, or a single file script you send off to a colleague over Slack. Very, very common scenario for many of us. If your script depends on a => c b => c You can pin versions of those direct dependencies like "a" and "b" easy enough, but 2 years later you may not get the same version of "c", unless the authors of "a" and "b" handle their dependency constraints perfectly. In practice that's really hard and never happens. The timestamp appraoch described above isn't perfect, but would result in the same dep graph, and results, 99% of the time..

__s 2y ago
Rust tends to handle this well. It'll share c if possible, or split dependencies. Cargo.lock preserves exact resolution
lmm 2y ago
Try Scala with an Ammonite script like https://ammonite.io/#ScalaScripts https://ammonite.io/#ScalaScripts . The JVM ecosystem does dependencies right, there's no need to "pin" in the first place because dependency resolution is deterministic to start with. (Upgrading to e.g. all newer patch versions of your current dependencies is easy, but you have to make an explicit action to do so, it will never happen "magically")

kokada 2y ago

> 1 file, 2 files, N files, why does it matter how many files? One file is better for sharing than N, you can post it in a messenger program like Slack and easily copy-and-paste (while this becomes annoying with more than one file), or upload this somewhere without needing to compress, etc. > I can't think of any other language where "I want my script to use dependencies from the Internet, pinned to precise versions" is a thing. This is the same issue you would have in any other programming language. If it is fine for possibly having breakage in the future you don't need to do it, but I can understand the use case for it.

lenkite 2y ago

For N scripts, you will need N lock files littering your directories and then need venvs for all of them. Sometimes, the lock files can be larger than the scripts themselves...

epistasis 2y ago

I think it's a general principle across all of software engineering that, when given the choice, fewer disparate locations in the codebase need to have correlated changes. Documentation is hard enough, and that's often right there at exactly the same location.

deanishe 2y ago

> why does it matter how many files? Because this is for scripts in ~/bin, not projects. They need to be self-contained.