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How long did Israel’s supply chain attack on Hezbollah’s pager source stay clandestine? How long did the USA keep it hidden that they owned the Swiss company t

How long did Israel’s supply chain attack on Hezbollah’s pager source stay clandestine? How long did the USA keep it hidden that they owned the Swiss company that manufactured encryption devices for other countries? They are extremely adept at finding ways to use the secret knowledge without blowing their source. A good example of this is the scene in _The Imitation Game_ after they break the Enigma code for the first time, but Alan Turing explains that they can’t notify the allied ship convoy without leaking that fact.

andix 2y ago
As long as you are not a terrorist, all those surveillance programs will never be used against you. It would put those programs to risk, by exposing them. If you need to protect yourself against the most sophisticated surveillance programs, a lot of opsec will be required. VPNs can protect you against some creep in a public WiFi spying on your DNS request. It can protect against some low-tech state run mass surveillance.
- waveBidder 2y ago
  Good thing the US doesn't have an administration that will happily criminalize any opposition
  - andix 2y ago
    If this is your threat model, then VPNs are definitively not enough. Still a European VPN provider might be better than nothing.
- JTyQZSnP3cQGa8B 2y ago
  > As long as you are not a terrorist, all those surveillance programs will never be used against you Can you say "as long as you have nothing to hide"? We’ve known since WW2 and maybe further that governments have used surveillance against innocents and people they didn’t like.
  - andix 2y ago
    So you're suggesting to use Tor for everything? Or what's your solution?
- impossiblefork 2y ago
  All those surveillance programs are a threat to everyone who wants to keep the technology he and his company develops. There is nothing preventing programs of that sort being used for industrial espionage.
wfn 2y ago
This may be a useful notion and term to start using when thinking about these things: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Threat_model https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Threat_model (not being smirky; I should use apply it more often myself, e.g.) With this in mind, I'll link my prev comment: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43095936 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43095936 > Israel’s supply chain attack on Hezbollah’s pager source You know, James Mickens, a CS researcher at Microsoft had a very related article (PDF), "This world of ours": https://www.usenix.org/system/files/1401_08-12_mickens.pdf https://www.usenix.org/system/files/1401_08-12_mickens.pdf See Figure 1. He calls it the "Mossad / Not-Mossad threat model" :) (but, joking aside, it's good to identify oneself on a scale, or expectations for some system scale-wise and property-wise (incl. which security properties, esp. privacy vs. anonymity!) before looking closer at it.

andix 2y ago

As long as you are not a terrorist, all those surveillance programs will never be used against you. It would put those programs to risk, by exposing them. If you need to protect yourself against the most sophisticated surveillance programs, a lot of opsec will be required. VPNs can protect you against some creep in a public WiFi spying on your DNS request. It can protect against some low-tech state run mass surveillance.

waveBidder 2y ago
Good thing the US doesn't have an administration that will happily criminalize any opposition
- andix 2y ago
  If this is your threat model, then VPNs are definitively not enough. Still a European VPN provider might be better than nothing.
JTyQZSnP3cQGa8B 2y ago
> As long as you are not a terrorist, all those surveillance programs will never be used against you Can you say "as long as you have nothing to hide"? We’ve known since WW2 and maybe further that governments have used surveillance against innocents and people they didn’t like.
- andix 2y ago
  So you're suggesting to use Tor for everything? Or what's your solution?
impossiblefork 2y ago
All those surveillance programs are a threat to everyone who wants to keep the technology he and his company develops. There is nothing preventing programs of that sort being used for industrial espionage.

wfn 2y ago

This may be a useful notion and term to start using when thinking about these things: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Threat_model https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Threat_model (not being smirky; I should use apply it more often myself, e.g.) With this in mind, I'll link my prev comment: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43095936 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43095936 > Israel’s supply chain attack on Hezbollah’s pager source You know, James Mickens, a CS researcher at Microsoft had a very related article (PDF), "This world of ours": https://www.usenix.org/system/files/1401_08-12_mickens.pdf https://www.usenix.org/system/files/1401_08-12_mickens.pdf See Figure 1. He calls it the "Mossad / Not-Mossad threat model" :) (but, joking aside, it's good to identify oneself on a scale, or expectations for some system scale-wise and property-wise (incl. which security properties, esp. privacy vs. anonymity!) before looking closer at it.