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Just for a different point of view, my wife is Type 1 Diabetic - no way she’d be leaving her medical stuff. It’s probably not that, but is possible.

throw0101c 2y ago
> Just for a different point of view, my wife is Type 1 Diabetic - no way she’d be leaving her medical stuff. Perhaps a fanny pack would be a better idea: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fanny_pack https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fanny_pack
- latexr 2y ago
  Yes, better use a fanny pack and have it on you at all times. Don’t even remove it and store it in your bag temporarily when on an airplane, you never know if it’ll capsize on landing and you’ll need to avoid people on the internet criticising you. It also goes without saying that you should keep in on while showering and sleeping too, you never know when your hotel could catch on fire.
  - throw0101c 2y ago
    > Don’t even remove it and store it in your bag temporarily when on an airplane, you never know if it’ll capsize on landing and you’ll need to avoid people on the internet criticising you. You'll need to first avoid succumbing to smoke inhalation or flames if you don't get out in time (or cause someone else to not get out because your fumbling). The take-offs and landings (and perhaps add approach) phases of flight constitute ~5% of flight time, but the vast majority of the fatalities: * https://flightsafety.org/asw-article/loc-i-accidents-led-other-categories-data-show/ https://flightsafety.org/asw-article/loc-i-accidents-led-oth...
    - latexr 2y ago
      Do you see lots of smoke and flames in this video? There are several people outside already, with backpacks too. It is incredible how people feel entitled to, based on a split second from a video, judge so harshly another human being who just went through a traumatic experience. We weren’t there. The situation looks under control. For all you know this person gave their turn to others inside the plane so they could get out before her.
      - throw0101c 2y ago
        I'm not judging harshly: adrenaline dumps are a real thing. And even though it looks under control, a few passenger interviews have indicated that many folks didn't have time to think. But the whole point of all those procedures about turning stuff off and putting things is away is situations like this: you may or may not have time to think, and you may or may not have to deal with smoke or flames. And just because there weren't smoke/flames right at that moment, you can't tell if they would arrive "soon": planes have been completely engulfed in fire with-in 90 seconds in the past. The idea behind suggesting a fanny pack, and perhaps having all your cards and papers (and medicine) on your person, is so that if such a thing should happen you do not have to think to make sure you have what you need. So that in a panic you already have it with you if you get out just by the fact you got out and it was physically attached to you.
        latexr 2y ago
        On a second read, my original comment was unkind and I regret it. I lumped you in with all the other comments which I saw as unfairly criticising a situation most of us will never be in and responded with mockery, but that is neither an excuse nor fair to you. Your points are well reasoned—and I believe well-intentioned—and I should’ve done better. I apologise.
      - potato3732842 2y ago
        Heaven hath no fury like someone who works a desk job and lives the apartment/condo/nice subdivision life and is generally free from any physical danger judging other people's risk assessment.
- lolc 2y ago
  A fanny pack is actually where my reserve insulin is at all times. And the pack is attached to me most of the time. There's also some sugar in there too. People with T1 either have insulin pumps attached, or long-lasting insulin injected. They are not going to keel over from lack of insulin on most days, even if their pack is gone. Except if the pump stopped working hours ago, or they forgot to inject. Then they may be close to collapse already. And being away from sugar can become life-threatening quickly for people who shoot insulin. So overall they have a pretty good reason to always carry their stuff, even in an emergency. And yes, better always attached than in some bag than can get lost easily.
  - mthoms 2y ago
    I flew out of Toronto Pearson the day before this crash (after moving my flight a day forward because of the storms :-/ ), and noticed that flight attendants require passengers to remove any cross body fanny-pack type bags during takeoff and landing. I'm not sure if this applies to wearing it on the waist or not. I would imagine not. This might not be new or exclusive to Canada - it's just the first I've noticed it.
    - throw0101c 2y ago
      > This might not be new or exclusive to Canada - it's just the first I've noticed it. Not Canada-only: > So sorry for the disappointment with the carryon requirements. Please know that your fanny pack is considered a personal item and must be stowed properly during taxi, takeoff, and landing. Still, we understand the frustration and have documented your concern. * https://twitter.com/SouthwestAir/status/1796641027924889819 https://twitter.com/SouthwestAir/status/1796641027924889819 * https://viewfromthewing.com/stupid-airline-carry-on-rules-if-its-on-your-body-it-should-count-as-part-of-your-clothes/ https://viewfromthewing.com/stupid-airline-carry-on-rules-if... It may be a case of people abusing things and instead of a 'small' pack, they have a 'regular' purse and are trying to call it fanny pack. Then actually have a purse / personal item and a carry-on.
aziaziazi 2y ago
I don’t know much about T1 diabet so please excuse me if I’m asking the obvious: don’t you expect to find everything necessary in an international airport like Toronto? I mean in pharmacies but also with the airport medic team? My first though in a similar crash would be to get out ASAP to avoid me or someone else roasting, although it may be so stressful that rational thinking may not be at its best.
- latexr 2y ago
  Maybe you’ll find everything you need readily available at the airport, or maybe everyone will be busy dealing with the current situation and won’t be able to help you on time. Maybe they’ll need to send someone back for your bag and that’s going to take hours or days before they give it back to you. Maybe you having to wait makes you miss on other care. People die in hospital waiting rooms. Why risk it when you know you have everything you need right on hand? At this time in the video the situation looked to already be fairly under control. Worrying about recording a video on your phone to post to social media before you’re even out seems worse.
  - sfilmeyer 2y ago
    > People die in hospital waiting rooms. Why risk it when you know you have everything you need right on hand? Because people also die in incomplete airplane evacuations. In the Aeroflot Flight 1492 crash, 41 of 78 occupants died while folks were seen evacuating with their bags. Some of them would have died no matter what, but somebody slowing down an evacuation from a serious airplane crash for even just seconds to quickly grab their insulin kit out from under the seat in front of them (let alone to film for social media or whatever else) could cost someone else their life. The situation might look "fairly under control", but the plane is upside down, leaking flammable jetfuel, and surrounded by firefighting foam that no one wants to spend more time around than they have to. Leaving behind medical supplies in a crash has a real impact on a diabetic or similar, but any slowdown to the evacuation also has a real impact on all of the other passengers.
- bmgxyz 2y ago
  My wife is also T1 diabetic. In principle, yes, a major airport's medical team should have everything that a diabetic needs to survive. However, depending on the person's blood sugar level at any given moment, it may be necessary to give them either insulin or sugar immediately or they will become disoriented, unable to move reliably, and maybe pass out. Hypoglycemia and hyperglycemia can quickly become medical emergencies. Given all that, it makes sense for a diabetic to be highly protective of their insulin and sugar supplements. In a crash, the medical team is probably going to be pretty busy and might not provide optimal treatment to a diabetic right away. A "pancreas kit" can fit in a bag small enough to be carried in one hand, so it shouldn't be necessary to hold up an evacuation by carrying something large. As others have mentioned, this is also likely an instinctive reaction, and it's hard to criticize someone for reacting that way in such a stressful situation.
kergonath 2y ago
It’s better to be outside the aircraft, alive and without your stuff than inside and dead. You can get insulin in any western city.
- xiphias2 2y ago
  I'm not sure it's so easy, I travel a lot, and western cities are the hardest to get any medication. In Hawaii we were robbed with my girlfriend and went to a pharmacy and to doctor with no papers and we weren't able to refill our contraception pill (pharmacy told us to go to doctor, doctors said we need a lot of tests even though she was already taking the medication and we had police reports). Generally it's not advised to skip a day, and skipping 2 is not allowed, but doctors didn't care. (after a lot of search we found out that Amazon online clinic is much better and even cheaper with prescriptions). In latin america or Thailand or anywhere else in the world we could just go to a pharmacy and get what we want.
fortran77 2y ago
I carry a very small cross body pack with my essentials (passort, meds, emergency card and cash) that I strap on before descent and at any other time there's a chance I'll get separated from my bags.
adamanonymous 2y ago
No medical condition has higher priority than getting out of a burning plane as fast as possible. You may not survive a day without insulin, but the people behind you might not survive the next few seconds if they can't get out in time because you were fumbling with a bag
- potato3732842 2y ago
  I hate your opinion not because leaving one's bag isn't a fair take most of the time but it is underpinned by a the fundamental contempt for the decision making of people who are actually there. It's like when a child gets a math problem right but the shown work makes it clear they're very wrong. You don't know what's in that luggage. Maybe it's hard to source medication. Maybe it's very important legal documents. It's clearly not big enough to be typical low value personal belongings. The plane isn't even full of smoke yet.
  - antidumbass 2y ago
    If adamanonymous' opinion was worth the pixels it was printed on, he wouldn't need to post it anonymously. Ditto for me.
  - sfilmeyer 2y ago
    I get that folks are going to make suboptimal choices in the heat of the moment, and I could see myself similarly making a dumb choice in the rush of an airplane evacuation. I don't think we should judge anyone's character too harshly, but that doesn't keep us from discussing what the actual optimal choices are. >The plane isn't even full of smoke yet The plane previously had some pretty impressive flames in the process of landing, and depending one what sort of fire gets going there might not be time for everyone to get out. That being said, insulin isn't actually a valid excuse nor are very important legal documents. Every second counts, and could be the difference between life and death for passengers and crew not yet evacuated. There's a reason that air traffic controllers ask pilots in emergencies for the number of "souls on board" referring to living humans and not important legal documents or medicine.

throw0101c 2y ago

> Just for a different point of view, my wife is Type 1 Diabetic - no way she’d be leaving her medical stuff. Perhaps a fanny pack would be a better idea: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fanny_pack https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fanny_pack

latexr 2y ago
Yes, better use a fanny pack and have it on you at all times. Don’t even remove it and store it in your bag temporarily when on an airplane, you never know if it’ll capsize on landing and you’ll need to avoid people on the internet criticising you. It also goes without saying that you should keep in on while showering and sleeping too, you never know when your hotel could catch on fire.
- throw0101c 2y ago
  > Don’t even remove it and store it in your bag temporarily when on an airplane, you never know if it’ll capsize on landing and you’ll need to avoid people on the internet criticising you. You'll need to first avoid succumbing to smoke inhalation or flames if you don't get out in time (or cause someone else to not get out because your fumbling). The take-offs and landings (and perhaps add approach) phases of flight constitute ~5% of flight time, but the vast majority of the fatalities: * https://flightsafety.org/asw-article/loc-i-accidents-led-other-categories-data-show/ https://flightsafety.org/asw-article/loc-i-accidents-led-oth...
  - latexr 2y ago
    Do you see lots of smoke and flames in this video? There are several people outside already, with backpacks too. It is incredible how people feel entitled to, based on a split second from a video, judge so harshly another human being who just went through a traumatic experience. We weren’t there. The situation looks under control. For all you know this person gave their turn to others inside the plane so they could get out before her.
    - throw0101c 2y ago
      I'm not judging harshly: adrenaline dumps are a real thing. And even though it looks under control, a few passenger interviews have indicated that many folks didn't have time to think. But the whole point of all those procedures about turning stuff off and putting things is away is situations like this: you may or may not have time to think, and you may or may not have to deal with smoke or flames. And just because there weren't smoke/flames right at that moment, you can't tell if they would arrive "soon": planes have been completely engulfed in fire with-in 90 seconds in the past. The idea behind suggesting a fanny pack, and perhaps having all your cards and papers (and medicine) on your person, is so that if such a thing should happen you do not have to think to make sure you have what you need. So that in a panic you already have it with you if you get out just by the fact you got out and it was physically attached to you.
      - latexr 2y ago
        On a second read, my original comment was unkind and I regret it. I lumped you in with all the other comments which I saw as unfairly criticising a situation most of us will never be in and responded with mockery, but that is neither an excuse nor fair to you. Your points are well reasoned—and I believe well-intentioned—and I should’ve done better. I apologise.
    - potato3732842 2y ago
      Heaven hath no fury like someone who works a desk job and lives the apartment/condo/nice subdivision life and is generally free from any physical danger judging other people's risk assessment.
lolc 2y ago
A fanny pack is actually where my reserve insulin is at all times. And the pack is attached to me most of the time. There's also some sugar in there too. People with T1 either have insulin pumps attached, or long-lasting insulin injected. They are not going to keel over from lack of insulin on most days, even if their pack is gone. Except if the pump stopped working hours ago, or they forgot to inject. Then they may be close to collapse already. And being away from sugar can become life-threatening quickly for people who shoot insulin. So overall they have a pretty good reason to always carry their stuff, even in an emergency. And yes, better always attached than in some bag than can get lost easily.
- mthoms 2y ago
  I flew out of Toronto Pearson the day before this crash (after moving my flight a day forward because of the storms :-/ ), and noticed that flight attendants require passengers to remove any cross body fanny-pack type bags during takeoff and landing. I'm not sure if this applies to wearing it on the waist or not. I would imagine not. This might not be new or exclusive to Canada - it's just the first I've noticed it.
  - throw0101c 2y ago
    > This might not be new or exclusive to Canada - it's just the first I've noticed it. Not Canada-only: > So sorry for the disappointment with the carryon requirements. Please know that your fanny pack is considered a personal item and must be stowed properly during taxi, takeoff, and landing. Still, we understand the frustration and have documented your concern. * https://twitter.com/SouthwestAir/status/1796641027924889819 https://twitter.com/SouthwestAir/status/1796641027924889819 * https://viewfromthewing.com/stupid-airline-carry-on-rules-if-its-on-your-body-it-should-count-as-part-of-your-clothes/ https://viewfromthewing.com/stupid-airline-carry-on-rules-if... It may be a case of people abusing things and instead of a 'small' pack, they have a 'regular' purse and are trying to call it fanny pack. Then actually have a purse / personal item and a carry-on.

aziaziazi 2y ago

I don’t know much about T1 diabet so please excuse me if I’m asking the obvious: don’t you expect to find everything necessary in an international airport like Toronto? I mean in pharmacies but also with the airport medic team? My first though in a similar crash would be to get out ASAP to avoid me or someone else roasting, although it may be so stressful that rational thinking may not be at its best.

latexr 2y ago
Maybe you’ll find everything you need readily available at the airport, or maybe everyone will be busy dealing with the current situation and won’t be able to help you on time. Maybe they’ll need to send someone back for your bag and that’s going to take hours or days before they give it back to you. Maybe you having to wait makes you miss on other care. People die in hospital waiting rooms. Why risk it when you know you have everything you need right on hand? At this time in the video the situation looked to already be fairly under control. Worrying about recording a video on your phone to post to social media before you’re even out seems worse.
- sfilmeyer 2y ago
  > People die in hospital waiting rooms. Why risk it when you know you have everything you need right on hand? Because people also die in incomplete airplane evacuations. In the Aeroflot Flight 1492 crash, 41 of 78 occupants died while folks were seen evacuating with their bags. Some of them would have died no matter what, but somebody slowing down an evacuation from a serious airplane crash for even just seconds to quickly grab their insulin kit out from under the seat in front of them (let alone to film for social media or whatever else) could cost someone else their life. The situation might look "fairly under control", but the plane is upside down, leaking flammable jetfuel, and surrounded by firefighting foam that no one wants to spend more time around than they have to. Leaving behind medical supplies in a crash has a real impact on a diabetic or similar, but any slowdown to the evacuation also has a real impact on all of the other passengers.
bmgxyz 2y ago
My wife is also T1 diabetic. In principle, yes, a major airport's medical team should have everything that a diabetic needs to survive. However, depending on the person's blood sugar level at any given moment, it may be necessary to give them either insulin or sugar immediately or they will become disoriented, unable to move reliably, and maybe pass out. Hypoglycemia and hyperglycemia can quickly become medical emergencies. Given all that, it makes sense for a diabetic to be highly protective of their insulin and sugar supplements. In a crash, the medical team is probably going to be pretty busy and might not provide optimal treatment to a diabetic right away. A "pancreas kit" can fit in a bag small enough to be carried in one hand, so it shouldn't be necessary to hold up an evacuation by carrying something large. As others have mentioned, this is also likely an instinctive reaction, and it's hard to criticize someone for reacting that way in such a stressful situation.

kergonath 2y ago

It’s better to be outside the aircraft, alive and without your stuff than inside and dead. You can get insulin in any western city.

xiphias2 2y ago
I'm not sure it's so easy, I travel a lot, and western cities are the hardest to get any medication. In Hawaii we were robbed with my girlfriend and went to a pharmacy and to doctor with no papers and we weren't able to refill our contraception pill (pharmacy told us to go to doctor, doctors said we need a lot of tests even though she was already taking the medication and we had police reports). Generally it's not advised to skip a day, and skipping 2 is not allowed, but doctors didn't care. (after a lot of search we found out that Amazon online clinic is much better and even cheaper with prescriptions). In latin america or Thailand or anywhere else in the world we could just go to a pharmacy and get what we want.

fortran77 2y ago

I carry a very small cross body pack with my essentials (passort, meds, emergency card and cash) that I strap on before descent and at any other time there's a chance I'll get separated from my bags.

adamanonymous 2y ago

No medical condition has higher priority than getting out of a burning plane as fast as possible. You may not survive a day without insulin, but the people behind you might not survive the next few seconds if they can't get out in time because you were fumbling with a bag

potato3732842 2y ago
I hate your opinion not because leaving one's bag isn't a fair take most of the time but it is underpinned by a the fundamental contempt for the decision making of people who are actually there. It's like when a child gets a math problem right but the shown work makes it clear they're very wrong. You don't know what's in that luggage. Maybe it's hard to source medication. Maybe it's very important legal documents. It's clearly not big enough to be typical low value personal belongings. The plane isn't even full of smoke yet.
- antidumbass 2y ago
  If adamanonymous' opinion was worth the pixels it was printed on, he wouldn't need to post it anonymously. Ditto for me.
- sfilmeyer 2y ago
  I get that folks are going to make suboptimal choices in the heat of the moment, and I could see myself similarly making a dumb choice in the rush of an airplane evacuation. I don't think we should judge anyone's character too harshly, but that doesn't keep us from discussing what the actual optimal choices are. >The plane isn't even full of smoke yet The plane previously had some pretty impressive flames in the process of landing, and depending one what sort of fire gets going there might not be time for everyone to get out. That being said, insulin isn't actually a valid excuse nor are very important legal documents. Every second counts, and could be the difference between life and death for passengers and crew not yet evacuated. There's a reason that air traffic controllers ask pilots in emergencies for the number of "souls on board" referring to living humans and not important legal documents or medicine.