6 ms·

'Honestly terrifying': Yosemite National Park is in chaos

116 points by tzs 2y ago

sys32768 2y ago
[flagged]
- fsckmsk 2y ago
  [flagged]
  - defrost 2y ago
    The solution (not my solution you understand, but the Cliven Bundy et al mindset solution) is to reverse Federal Parks, privatise the commons, return cattle grazing to once national forests, allow the market to extract value and juice and leave a dry husk for citizens who are fenced out in any case.
dashundchen 2y ago
Trump, Musk and co don't care. If it doesn't benefit them and they can't profit from it, it doesn't matter. What are the odds there's chaos in the parks this summer with short staffing, and the admin decides to blame the National Parks Service as a reason to privatize management of the parks?
- stevenwoo 2y ago
  They are not going to privatize management - they are going to sell the land so the federal government does not own it anymore and give it to themselves in the form of tax breaks, subsidies to regime friendly companies.
fsckmsk 2y ago
[flagged]
- datavirtue 2y ago
  How dare to question the great and powerful Orange One!! His great coming was fortold in the book of Revelation, wherein he cuts the heads off of the Magnificent Seven. He, the great Orange One, is the 8th head that is part of the seven but is destined to destroy them and ride off on a white horse.
umeshunni 2y ago
If a 5% layoff that sets them back to 2022 levels of headcount leads to chaos, maybe the problem is much deeper.
- computerthings 2y ago
  [flagged]
  - paleotrope 2y ago
    "Malicious compliance" then.
    - computerthings 2y ago
      Malicious compliance what? And what did my comment get flagged for?
- tzs 2y ago
  Did you miss the part about hiring being frozen so that they cannot hire the several hundred seasonal workers that they would normally be hiring now to handle the summer load?
- Projectiboga 2y ago
  5% of total staff mostly frontline crew, could cause chaos. Especially if under staffed already.
- TheCleric 2y ago
  It will if they are at 150% of 2022 attendance (which they were in 2024).
- fzeroracer 2y ago
  Point me towards any company and order me to lay off 5% of individuals up to my own personal discretion and I guarantee you I can find a way to break it.
- gosub100 2y ago
warabe 2y ago
[flagged]
hindsightbias 2y ago
I’ll bet DOGE could code up an auction system in no time. Or turn it over to Ticketmaster. Think of the profits.
- jcgrillo 2y ago
  Or just open it up to the entire Internet [1]. [1] https://www.engadget.com/cybersecurity/the-doge-website-is-seemingly-so-insecure-it-can-be-edited-by-anyone-160612228.html https://www.engadget.com/cybersecurity/the-doge-website-is-s...
- anon7000 2y ago
  You say that, but a private company already manages the reservation system, and profits off of all the junk fees
  - collingreen 2y ago
    Shhh, don't let the facts get in the way of the bootlicking.
    - seanp2k2 2y ago
      But what if we had LexisNexis run it and charge a $350 processing fee for entrance passes with a 3-8 business week processing time?
SignalM 2y ago
[flagged]
- EasyMark 2y ago
  You need employees to stop those people walking around from destroying everything in site. Fires, garbage, etc. It's a legitimate concern, and a disgrace what the current regime is trying to do. Next will be attempts to privatize and sell off the national park system to billionaires.
  - deleted 2y ago
    [deleted]
- realitysballs 2y ago
  Only in the USA would people be ignorant enough to rescind funding that supports the protection and conservation of world-famous wildlife resources that also are able to sustain there own revenue source. Yosemite can pay for itself and then some if the government just let people work and collect fees (aka fee technicians).
- calmbell 2y ago
  Do you support defunding the police in your jurisdiction? Paid National Park Service employees are the only law enforcement officers in the park.
- quesera 2y ago
  You are exhibiting signs of California Derangement Syndrome. It's contagious, and although not fatal, can be super embarrassing in public. Get it checked out.
- hot_gril 2y ago
  Do other states not have park rangers?
JKCalhoun 2y ago
Reminded of what happened during Covid when a few asshats decided to go into the public's parks and started tagging everything.
mossTechnician 2y ago
1. Find a working government service and decimate its employees 2. Point to the service and say it's always been broken 3. Sell devalued service for profit
conductr 2y ago
People pay to visit right? Why doesn’t the revenue match the necessary operation expenses and the whole thing just function as a non-profit business? I don’t know what type of budget and expenses go into running this park in an ideal scenario, and what the revenue shortfall might be that would require additional taxpayer subsidies, but it seems like the obvious solution here is the ask people using the park to pay for the majority of its operations
- dkasper 2y ago
  The popular national parks like Yosemite do pay for themselves, so that’s how it works, it’s just run by the government instead of a corporation.
- psadauskas 2y ago
  It also looks like it does pay for itself: https://www.nps.gov/yose/learn/management/statistics.htm https://www.nps.gov/yose/learn/management/statistics.htm > 2021 Operating Budget: Approximately $30 million > Park visitors: 3,343,988 (2021) An entrance pass is $35 (per vehicle) or $20 (per person). I imagine Yosemite, being one of the most popular National Parks, subsidizes the others. That said, the National Parks are one of this nation's greatest accomplishments, and would be a bargain at 10x the cost. Trump (or rather his sycophants) would rather see them collapse as further "proof" of government as a failure, and to open the lands up to private resource extraction, like logging, mining and drilling.
  - votepaunchy 2y ago
    > An entrance pass is $35 (per vehicle) or $20 (per person). Anyone visiting more than one park is almost certainly buying the $80 annual pass (free for military) or lifetime senior pass.
    - psadauskas 2y ago
      Yup, including me! I buy one every year, even if I'm only planning on visiting 1 or 2 parks that year. Same with the Colorado State parks annual pass. I have no problem about going above and beyond for just a wonderful resource, so that others who are less fortunate might also be able to visit. You didn't specify if you thought that detracted from my point, though.
throwaway4736 2y ago
[flagged]
- waltercool 2y ago
  Hey mods, how is this even helping to discourse? I got some comments flagged for less than that.
  - gnabgib 2y ago
    This comment is both flagged and dead.
waltercool 2y ago
- Why is this being posted in Hacker News? This is technology related stuff. - Do you realize Trump assumed less than a month ago? Even when this government is trying to resolve the huge amount of federal waste, it is normal to wait couple of months until it stabilizes. I remember when my country did a massive reform to the judiciary, it was entirely chaotic for few months. Under a certain problem you can always hire more people and expect that resolves the issue, but this goes against efficiency as government doesn't have accountability (just check US debt!). Resolving an efficiency issue is always difficult and chaotic until it stabilizes, governments around the world are known for never updating their processes. They don't even have a database for Social Security!
ashoeafoot 2y ago
"Lets go back to when things were simple" the attempt to save energy of the mind, rolled out across the political spectrum ,as khemer rouge, liberal or anti-deepstate, having a happy little selfdestruct incarnation .
jacknews 2y ago
"fee technicians — the people who collect money at park entrances and campgrounds — who were two months into the hiring process" What? It takes two months+ to hire a ticket seller? Ridiculous.
- jaxtracks 2y ago
  Those are actually difficult hires to make. Huge number of low-quality applicants, but the standards for park employees are actually quite high, and admin tries to hire for passion which helps with retention and sustaining their unique culture (imo park staff are by and large excellent folks and most have impressive backgrounds relative to their position.) The immediately tangible upshot to this approach is retention, lots of those "booth jockeys" return many years in a row, or grow into admin/ranger roles. Staff morale and visitor experience will suffer if the careful selection process is eased, and retention woes will probably cause a measurable fiscal impact to operational budgets once the passion-hire cohort churns out. Selecting for passion takes time. It's the same when you're hiring to build a company with an exceptional culture.
exabrial 2y ago
This was known problem in 2024 unfortunately: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d24PTLHEu_Q https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d24PTLHEu_Q Budgets are set a year ahead of time.

116 points by tzs 2y ago

sys32768 2y ago

[flagged]

fsckmsk 2y ago
[flagged]
- defrost 2y ago
  The solution (not my solution you understand, but the Cliven Bundy et al mindset solution) is to reverse Federal Parks, privatise the commons, return cattle grazing to once national forests, allow the market to extract value and juice and leave a dry husk for citizens who are fenced out in any case.

dashundchen 2y ago

Trump, Musk and co don't care. If it doesn't benefit them and they can't profit from it, it doesn't matter. What are the odds there's chaos in the parks this summer with short staffing, and the admin decides to blame the National Parks Service as a reason to privatize management of the parks?

stevenwoo 2y ago
They are not going to privatize management - they are going to sell the land so the federal government does not own it anymore and give it to themselves in the form of tax breaks, subsidies to regime friendly companies.

fsckmsk 2y ago

[flagged]

datavirtue 2y ago
How dare to question the great and powerful Orange One!! His great coming was fortold in the book of Revelation, wherein he cuts the heads off of the Magnificent Seven. He, the great Orange One, is the 8th head that is part of the seven but is destined to destroy them and ride off on a white horse.

umeshunni 2y ago

If a 5% layoff that sets them back to 2022 levels of headcount leads to chaos, maybe the problem is much deeper.

computerthings 2y ago
[flagged]
- paleotrope 2y ago
  "Malicious compliance" then.
  - computerthings 2y ago
    Malicious compliance what? And what did my comment get flagged for?
tzs 2y ago
Did you miss the part about hiring being frozen so that they cannot hire the several hundred seasonal workers that they would normally be hiring now to handle the summer load?
Projectiboga 2y ago
5% of total staff mostly frontline crew, could cause chaos. Especially if under staffed already.
TheCleric 2y ago
It will if they are at 150% of 2022 attendance (which they were in 2024).
fzeroracer 2y ago
Point me towards any company and order me to lay off 5% of individuals up to my own personal discretion and I guarantee you I can find a way to break it.
gosub100 2y ago

warabe 2y ago

[flagged]

hindsightbias 2y ago

I’ll bet DOGE could code up an auction system in no time. Or turn it over to Ticketmaster. Think of the profits.

jcgrillo 2y ago
Or just open it up to the entire Internet [1]. [1] https://www.engadget.com/cybersecurity/the-doge-website-is-seemingly-so-insecure-it-can-be-edited-by-anyone-160612228.html https://www.engadget.com/cybersecurity/the-doge-website-is-s...
anon7000 2y ago
You say that, but a private company already manages the reservation system, and profits off of all the junk fees
- collingreen 2y ago
  Shhh, don't let the facts get in the way of the bootlicking.
  - seanp2k2 2y ago
    But what if we had LexisNexis run it and charge a $350 processing fee for entrance passes with a 3-8 business week processing time?

SignalM 2y ago

[flagged]

EasyMark 2y ago
You need employees to stop those people walking around from destroying everything in site. Fires, garbage, etc. It's a legitimate concern, and a disgrace what the current regime is trying to do. Next will be attempts to privatize and sell off the national park system to billionaires.
- deleted 2y ago
  [deleted]
realitysballs 2y ago
Only in the USA would people be ignorant enough to rescind funding that supports the protection and conservation of world-famous wildlife resources that also are able to sustain there own revenue source. Yosemite can pay for itself and then some if the government just let people work and collect fees (aka fee technicians).
calmbell 2y ago
Do you support defunding the police in your jurisdiction? Paid National Park Service employees are the only law enforcement officers in the park.
quesera 2y ago
You are exhibiting signs of California Derangement Syndrome. It's contagious, and although not fatal, can be super embarrassing in public. Get it checked out.
hot_gril 2y ago
Do other states not have park rangers?

JKCalhoun 2y ago

Reminded of what happened during Covid when a few asshats decided to go into the public's parks and started tagging everything.

mossTechnician 2y ago

1. Find a working government service and decimate its employees 2. Point to the service and say it's always been broken 3. Sell devalued service for profit

conductr 2y ago

People pay to visit right? Why doesn’t the revenue match the necessary operation expenses and the whole thing just function as a non-profit business? I don’t know what type of budget and expenses go into running this park in an ideal scenario, and what the revenue shortfall might be that would require additional taxpayer subsidies, but it seems like the obvious solution here is the ask people using the park to pay for the majority of its operations

dkasper 2y ago
The popular national parks like Yosemite do pay for themselves, so that’s how it works, it’s just run by the government instead of a corporation.
psadauskas 2y ago
It also looks like it does pay for itself: https://www.nps.gov/yose/learn/management/statistics.htm https://www.nps.gov/yose/learn/management/statistics.htm > 2021 Operating Budget: Approximately $30 million > Park visitors: 3,343,988 (2021) An entrance pass is $35 (per vehicle) or $20 (per person). I imagine Yosemite, being one of the most popular National Parks, subsidizes the others. That said, the National Parks are one of this nation's greatest accomplishments, and would be a bargain at 10x the cost. Trump (or rather his sycophants) would rather see them collapse as further "proof" of government as a failure, and to open the lands up to private resource extraction, like logging, mining and drilling.
- votepaunchy 2y ago
  > An entrance pass is $35 (per vehicle) or $20 (per person). Anyone visiting more than one park is almost certainly buying the $80 annual pass (free for military) or lifetime senior pass.
  - psadauskas 2y ago
    Yup, including me! I buy one every year, even if I'm only planning on visiting 1 or 2 parks that year. Same with the Colorado State parks annual pass. I have no problem about going above and beyond for just a wonderful resource, so that others who are less fortunate might also be able to visit. You didn't specify if you thought that detracted from my point, though.

throwaway4736 2y ago

[flagged]

waltercool 2y ago
Hey mods, how is this even helping to discourse? I got some comments flagged for less than that.
- gnabgib 2y ago
  This comment is both flagged and dead.

waltercool 2y ago

- Why is this being posted in Hacker News? This is technology related stuff. - Do you realize Trump assumed less than a month ago? Even when this government is trying to resolve the huge amount of federal waste, it is normal to wait couple of months until it stabilizes. I remember when my country did a massive reform to the judiciary, it was entirely chaotic for few months. Under a certain problem you can always hire more people and expect that resolves the issue, but this goes against efficiency as government doesn't have accountability (just check US debt!). Resolving an efficiency issue is always difficult and chaotic until it stabilizes, governments around the world are known for never updating their processes. They don't even have a database for Social Security!

ashoeafoot 2y ago

"Lets go back to when things were simple" the attempt to save energy of the mind, rolled out across the political spectrum ,as khemer rouge, liberal or anti-deepstate, having a happy little selfdestruct incarnation .

jacknews 2y ago

"fee technicians — the people who collect money at park entrances and campgrounds — who were two months into the hiring process" What? It takes two months+ to hire a ticket seller? Ridiculous.

jaxtracks 2y ago
Those are actually difficult hires to make. Huge number of low-quality applicants, but the standards for park employees are actually quite high, and admin tries to hire for passion which helps with retention and sustaining their unique culture (imo park staff are by and large excellent folks and most have impressive backgrounds relative to their position.) The immediately tangible upshot to this approach is retention, lots of those "booth jockeys" return many years in a row, or grow into admin/ranger roles. Staff morale and visitor experience will suffer if the careful selection process is eased, and retention woes will probably cause a measurable fiscal impact to operational budgets once the passion-hire cohort churns out. Selecting for passion takes time. It's the same when you're hiring to build a company with an exceptional culture.

exabrial 2y ago

This was known problem in 2024 unfortunately: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d24PTLHEu_Q https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d24PTLHEu_Q Budgets are set a year ahead of time.