4 ms·

I don't see the comparison you are trying to make. Biden defined his entire political persona around centrism, bipartisanship, moderation, etc. He certainly mad

I don't see the comparison you are trying to make. Biden defined his entire political persona around centrism, bipartisanship, moderation, etc. He certainly made major mistakes (e.g. mismanaging the Afghan pullout, running for reelection); however, he didn't really display the cruelty or intolerance of different ways of life that is a core part of Trump's brand.

gadders 2y ago
I mean, that might be how he defined his persona, but I don't think it's borne out by the facts. I think there was quite a lot of intolerance of anybody that didn't fit in with the left wing view of culture war issues espoused by his government. He also oversaw numerous prosecutions of his political opponent, solely designed to stop him running.
- freeone3000 2y ago
  Didn’t those “political persecutions” end up with actual criminal convictions for fraud by an independent jury?
  - gadders 2y ago
    "independent jury". It was in New York. What do you think would happen if Biden or Hillary were tried by a jury in Florida or Texas?
    - buttercraft 2y ago
      Did voir dire not apply?
- petrarchy 2y ago
  > He also oversaw numerous prosecutions of his political opponent, solely designed to stop him running. Odd conclusion. Why would you think solely? Are you familiar with the evidence in the documents case? In the documents case, Trump clearly violated the law, based on evidence now in the public record. National security documents he was not entitled to were handled illegally, in ways that others have been prosecuted and convicted for. In really, really bad and scary ways, like nuclear-level secrets in an unlocked closet ways. With pictures. And videos. In the place he lets random foreign enemy political figures AND THEIR SECURITY STAFF run around. The predominant reason someone like Biden or Bush doesn’t get prosecuted is because they don’t do this shit. Second, because of norms, they transparently cooperate when they make mistakes. Even still, Trump was handled with kid gloves. The documents prosecution took years and was ultimately a massive waste of time. So if the sole reason was to disadvantage Trump, wasn’t it real dumb? Wouldn’t a more reasonable motivation be that the hundreds of elite law enforcement agents were doing their jobs / protect the country from a clear and present national security threat?
  - gadders 2y ago
    >>The predominant reason someone like Biden or Bush doesn’t get prosecuted is because they don’t do this shit. Biden mishandled secret documents but escaped prosecution by being mentally unfit. He kept them in his garage, I believe. Bill Clinton hid secret documents in his sock drawer. Hillary had her secret email server with classified information on.
    - petrarchy 2y ago
      “this shit” was not a referent to mishandling classified material. It was a referent to Trump having thousands of documents, including nuclear secrets and other SCIF material. Please provide evidence of any of these other people doing it with nuclear secrets. Please provide evidence of these other people risking national security by giving access to their sock drawers or email servers. Trump lets anyone into Mar A Lago. Anyone including known Chinese spies: https://www.npr.org/2019/09/11/759906611/chinese-woman-who-breached-mar-a-lago-security-found-guilty https://www.npr.org/2019/09/11/759906611/chinese-woman-who-b... Here’s a convenient wikipedia article summarizing sources and showing you pictures of what Trump did: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/FBI_search_of_Mar-a-Lago https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/FBI_search_of_Mar-a-Lago You honestly think these behaviors are equivalent or comparable severity?
      - gadders 2y ago
        Biden had SCIF material. I'm pretty sure Trump doesn't let just anyone into the rooms where the secret documents were. You realise Mar a Lago is a 17 acre country club, right? It's not a 3 bedroom house. And if you think Gmail is secure you need to read up on the DNC email leak.
        petrarchy 2y ago
        You followed up with more accusations without evidence, so I’ll stop engaging after this. But to your point about where they were, that would be a public bathroom amongst others: https://www.cnn.com/2023/06/09/politics/heres-where-donald-trump-allegedly-kept-classified-documents-at-mar-a-lago/index.html https://www.cnn.com/2023/06/09/politics/heres-where-donald-t... So yeah. I do think he completely and openly abused our country and everything it stands for, by letting anyone into those rooms, exactly as you implied. We know for a fact that ONE Chinese spy has been caught. I linked it already. So for all the other spies that weren’t caught - including Israeli, German, Russian, etc - they know exactly what Trump had. It’s a shame we don’t. My assumption is that he wasn’t prosecuted for treason because the documents weren’t actually valuable. Classified doesn’t mean important, just that we obey laws about it.

gadders 2y ago

I mean, that might be how he defined his persona, but I don't think it's borne out by the facts. I think there was quite a lot of intolerance of anybody that didn't fit in with the left wing view of culture war issues espoused by his government. He also oversaw numerous prosecutions of his political opponent, solely designed to stop him running.

freeone3000 2y ago
Didn’t those “political persecutions” end up with actual criminal convictions for fraud by an independent jury?
- gadders 2y ago
  "independent jury". It was in New York. What do you think would happen if Biden or Hillary were tried by a jury in Florida or Texas?
  - buttercraft 2y ago
    Did voir dire not apply?
petrarchy 2y ago
> He also oversaw numerous prosecutions of his political opponent, solely designed to stop him running. Odd conclusion. Why would you think solely? Are you familiar with the evidence in the documents case? In the documents case, Trump clearly violated the law, based on evidence now in the public record. National security documents he was not entitled to were handled illegally, in ways that others have been prosecuted and convicted for. In really, really bad and scary ways, like nuclear-level secrets in an unlocked closet ways. With pictures. And videos. In the place he lets random foreign enemy political figures AND THEIR SECURITY STAFF run around. The predominant reason someone like Biden or Bush doesn’t get prosecuted is because they don’t do this shit. Second, because of norms, they transparently cooperate when they make mistakes. Even still, Trump was handled with kid gloves. The documents prosecution took years and was ultimately a massive waste of time. So if the sole reason was to disadvantage Trump, wasn’t it real dumb? Wouldn’t a more reasonable motivation be that the hundreds of elite law enforcement agents were doing their jobs / protect the country from a clear and present national security threat?
- gadders 2y ago
  >>The predominant reason someone like Biden or Bush doesn’t get prosecuted is because they don’t do this shit. Biden mishandled secret documents but escaped prosecution by being mentally unfit. He kept them in his garage, I believe. Bill Clinton hid secret documents in his sock drawer. Hillary had her secret email server with classified information on.
  - petrarchy 2y ago
    “this shit” was not a referent to mishandling classified material. It was a referent to Trump having thousands of documents, including nuclear secrets and other SCIF material. Please provide evidence of any of these other people doing it with nuclear secrets. Please provide evidence of these other people risking national security by giving access to their sock drawers or email servers. Trump lets anyone into Mar A Lago. Anyone including known Chinese spies: https://www.npr.org/2019/09/11/759906611/chinese-woman-who-breached-mar-a-lago-security-found-guilty https://www.npr.org/2019/09/11/759906611/chinese-woman-who-b... Here’s a convenient wikipedia article summarizing sources and showing you pictures of what Trump did: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/FBI_search_of_Mar-a-Lago https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/FBI_search_of_Mar-a-Lago You honestly think these behaviors are equivalent or comparable severity?
    - gadders 2y ago
      Biden had SCIF material. I'm pretty sure Trump doesn't let just anyone into the rooms where the secret documents were. You realise Mar a Lago is a 17 acre country club, right? It's not a 3 bedroom house. And if you think Gmail is secure you need to read up on the DNC email leak.
      - petrarchy 2y ago
        You followed up with more accusations without evidence, so I’ll stop engaging after this. But to your point about where they were, that would be a public bathroom amongst others: https://www.cnn.com/2023/06/09/politics/heres-where-donald-trump-allegedly-kept-classified-documents-at-mar-a-lago/index.html https://www.cnn.com/2023/06/09/politics/heres-where-donald-t... So yeah. I do think he completely and openly abused our country and everything it stands for, by letting anyone into those rooms, exactly as you implied. We know for a fact that ONE Chinese spy has been caught. I linked it already. So for all the other spies that weren’t caught - including Israeli, German, Russian, etc - they know exactly what Trump had. It’s a shame we don’t. My assumption is that he wasn’t prosecuted for treason because the documents weren’t actually valuable. Classified doesn’t mean important, just that we obey laws about it.