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The belief in the myth that "the Chinese" are poor, stupid, backward, inferior etc. is what causes such suprise.

aurareturn 2y ago
Why would anyone believe that? In particular this forum. Everyone here has worked with a Chinese colleague smarter than them. China has 1.4 billion of them.
arpyzo 2y ago
I was under the impression that the surprise is that their authoritarian political system doesn't stifle the conditions required for this level of innovation.
- tim333 2y ago
  It's authoritarian in some ways - don't criticize the government etc - but I think they are fairly laissez faire in terms of most businesses doing their thing.
- fspeech 2y ago
  China proves that you don't need 100 times return on capital to get potential innovators to take risk. 100% may be enough. People say China couldn't innovate due to its weak IPR protection, but it is turning out that you don't need to be an absolutist. Sure outright theft is bad, but imitation can be good for competition. You want to give the innovators a head start so they can profit from their efforts, but you don't want to make the protection so tight that they can sit on their initial efforts and profit for years to come without further innovation.
  - blitzar 2y ago
    > Sure outright theft is bad, but imitation can be good for competition. Worked out pretty well for a small upstart nation in the late 18th century called the United States of America
xandrius 2y ago
Not really, it's about the general understanding that while China produces a lot of stuff for other countries, its own products are very often obvious knock-offs or subpar versions. Nothing to do with any myth, it's just how it is for a huge variety of reasons. And if you ever went to a university, you'd instantly lose that notion, since you'd be probably be interacting with both rich (or at least very well off) and intelligent Chinese people.
- SideburnsOfDoom 2y ago
  > China's own products are very often obvious knock-offs or subpar versions This view is increasingly outdated. Chinese EVs are well ahead of the rest. Solar power systems too. I am anticipating more "surprises" like DeepSeek where something ground-breaking comes from China as well as from Silicon Valley, Japan or elsewhere. Or like EVs where the Chinese firms are leaders in an advanced engineering industry.
  - xandrius 2y ago
    You've got to see the whole production, not just a few selected cases. As they say, the exceptions confirms the rule. While there are good examples, many people might not be currently familiar with them. Btw, I'm just explaining why the impression of Chinese products is there and why it doesn't have to be rooted in preconceptions Chinese people as a whole.

Why would anyone believe that? In particular this forum. Everyone here has worked with a Chinese colleague smarter than them. China has 1.4 billion of them.

arpyzo 2y ago

I was under the impression that the surprise is that their authoritarian political system doesn't stifle the conditions required for this level of innovation.

tim333 2y ago
It's authoritarian in some ways - don't criticize the government etc - but I think they are fairly laissez faire in terms of most businesses doing their thing.
fspeech 2y ago
China proves that you don't need 100 times return on capital to get potential innovators to take risk. 100% may be enough. People say China couldn't innovate due to its weak IPR protection, but it is turning out that you don't need to be an absolutist. Sure outright theft is bad, but imitation can be good for competition. You want to give the innovators a head start so they can profit from their efforts, but you don't want to make the protection so tight that they can sit on their initial efforts and profit for years to come without further innovation.
- blitzar 2y ago
  > Sure outright theft is bad, but imitation can be good for competition. Worked out pretty well for a small upstart nation in the late 18th century called the United States of America

xandrius 2y ago

Not really, it's about the general understanding that while China produces a lot of stuff for other countries, its own products are very often obvious knock-offs or subpar versions. Nothing to do with any myth, it's just how it is for a huge variety of reasons. And if you ever went to a university, you'd instantly lose that notion, since you'd be probably be interacting with both rich (or at least very well off) and intelligent Chinese people.

SideburnsOfDoom 2y ago
> China's own products are very often obvious knock-offs or subpar versions This view is increasingly outdated. Chinese EVs are well ahead of the rest. Solar power systems too. I am anticipating more "surprises" like DeepSeek where something ground-breaking comes from China as well as from Silicon Valley, Japan or elsewhere. Or like EVs where the Chinese firms are leaders in an advanced engineering industry.
- xandrius 2y ago
  You've got to see the whole production, not just a few selected cases. As they say, the exceptions confirms the rule. While there are good examples, many people might not be currently familiar with them. Btw, I'm just explaining why the impression of Chinese products is there and why it doesn't have to be rooted in preconceptions Chinese people as a whole.